Space Stations: Past, Present, And Future

[octave]

How cool is it that there is a helicopter on Mars that will hopefully fly soon?

 

This Helicopter Is Now On Mars!

[willedoo]

The ISS has seen years of constructive cooperation between NASA and Russia's space agency, Roscosmos. Generally, it has been insulated from politics and fragile relations between the two countries.

 

It has me wondering how long the Roscosmos head, Dmitry Rogozin, will be in the job. He's rapidly becoming a national embarrassment and just goes to show what happens when you give an ex politician the job. He's continually having to delete tweets that are derogatory toward the U.S. space achievements and well below the dignity and respect that the position demands.

 

When the Mars rover landed, instead of congratulations, he posted a tweet and meme that was as childish as it was offensive. After all their cooperation and achieving good things together, it must really disappoint the NASA people to see such an infantile mind in charge of their main partner in space. He has also been publicly ridiculing the achievements of Spacex. He seems to be a bit like Trump when it comes to his use of Twitter.

 

My tip is that Putin will soon sack the clown and give the job to an adult.

[willedoo]

Next month is the 60th. anniversary of human space flight. American toy company Mattel is modelling a Barbie doll on Russia's only female cosmonaut, Anna Kikina. It's part of Mattel's campaign aimed at inspiring young girls with role models. The doll will come with a flight suit and a space walk suit. They are saying that it won't be available for sale, but awarded as a contest prize commemorating the first human space flight. They didn't say whether only one is being awarded as a prize or several. Probably the latter, I'd guess.

 

Maybe in Russia, girls need inspiration to achieve a goal like becoming a cosmonaut, but there is no shortage of inspiration in the U.S. with their visibly high number of female astronauts. The American space programme has plenty of role models for girls.

[Old Koreelah]

On 18/03/2021 at 11:46 AM, willedoo said:

...American toy company Mattel is modelling a Barbie doll on Russia's only female cosmonaut, Anna Kikina...

Willi I presume you mean the Russians currently only have one female cosmonaut.

If so, that makes puts the Soviet government in a better light. They had females in space decades before the Yanks.

 

As a spotty-faced teenager, Valentina Tereshkova was one of my heroes.https://www.britannica.com/biography/Valentina-Tereshkova

 

 

[willedoo]

3 hours ago, Old Koreelah said:

Willi I presume you mean the Russians currently only have one female cosmonaut.

If so, that makes puts the Soviet government in a better light. They had females in space decades before the Yanks.

 

As a spotty-faced teenager, Valentina Tereshkova was one of my heroes.https://www.britannica.com/biography/Valentina-Tereshkova

 

 

Yes, currently, that's what I meant. When she goes up next year, she will be the fifth Russian woman to go into space. The Soviet Union put up two female cosmonauts, Valentina Tereshkova in 1963 and the second one almost twenty years later.

 

The Russian Federation has also put two female cosmonauts into space, in 1997 and 2014. The U.S. has put around fifty female astronauts into space in comparison, so the Russian side is still a bit blokey..

 

Valentina Tereshkova is still going strong, having turned 84 earlier this month. For the last ten years, she's been an influential member of the Russian lower house, the State Duma, equivalent of our Federal lower house of parliament. She has the position of deputy chair of the Committee on the Federal Structure and Local Government. It was Valentina who introduced the private member's bill to amend the new constitution to enable a reset for Putin to run for two more terms as President.

[octave]

NASA Ingenuity Mars Helicopter Prepares for First Flight

[willedoo]

It would be good to live for another 100 years to see how it all pans out. I find the space travel thing incredibly exciting. Imagine what we could do if we took all the money, talent and energy we use on trying to kill and dominate each other, and used it in cooperating in a friendly and scientific manner.

[willedoo]

11 hours ago, octave said:

NASA Ingenuity Mars Helicopter Prepares for First Flight

I like the way they worked the Wright Brothers into the story.

[Old Koreelah]

What we’ve learned about Mars so far reminds us how “lucky” we are to have our own green planet. Not only is it in the Goldilocks solar energy zone, it has the strong magnetic field and powerful lunar gravitation that has made it liveable.

[onetrack]

I'm afraid I fail to see what the advantages are to us on Planet Earth, trying to operate on, and populate distant planets, that do not, and never will support us, in our present life form.

 

We have a perfectly good planet right here, I believe we should expend some serious money fixing up this old comfortable place, rather than spending zillions travelling to the most inhospitable places in the Universe. I feel that a lot of this extra-terrestrial exploration is all about about massaging giant egos in industry, science and the political world.

[Old Koreelah]

11 hours ago, onetrack said:

I'm afraid I fail to see what the advantages are to us on Planet Earth, trying to operate on, and populate distant planets, that do not, and never will support us, in our present life form.

 

We have a perfectly good planet right here...

I totally agree with this part, OT, but the wider perspective should be taken.

Eventually our green planet will become uninhabitable*, so it would be prudent to do what life on earth has always done: spread out and find new places to inhabit.

 

*How life on earth could end:

Asteroid impact, causing global cataclysm.

Supervolcano(s) causing rapid global climate change.

A civilization-destroying nuclear war.

extraordinary sunspot activity.

A series of global pandemics

-or more likely- a combination of some of the above. 

[Jerry_Atrick]

And a few others on top OK..

 

The other thing to think about is what new elements, which can be then syntheised on eartth can be found for all sorts of things. I don't have the time at the moment to look it up, but, when I toured the Kennedy Space centre back in mid-90s, I am sure they said something like they discovered elements on the moon which they were able to harness back on earth to find cures for diseases previosuly incurable.

 

Of course, with the population explosion, whether that is a good thing or not (good if I get one of those diseases, questionable otherwise ;-)), is up for question.

 

The reality with colonising another planet is that, if there is another habitable planet (without significant support systems that may not even be practical), chances are, there will be things already living on it. And it is probably so far away, it will take more than a few lifetimes to get there (although, happy to be disproved and there is a reachable untouched paradise awaiting me).

 

Of course, we should continue with the space exploration bit and assign all the global defence budget to saving the earth.. Ahh, what a nice dream that is...

Edited March 27, 2021 by Jerry_Atrick

[pmccarthy]

There can be no new elements. The periodic table is full, up to the highly unstable end.

[octave]

I think the idea of terraforming an uninhabitable planet to replace this one is crazy.  If you can terraform Mars then you can surely terraform Earth to solve any problems (other than asteroid etc.)  Having said that I am in favour of working towards a presence on other planets.   for the foreseeable future this would be like Antarctica, no one lives there full time it is more like an outpost where scientific research takes place.

 

People will often say that we should not bother with space until we solve all the other problems, I disagree.   Firstly although a presence in space seems expensive it is a tiny percentage of the money spent.    The cost of going to the moon was approx.  28 Billion (283 Billion adjusted for inflation).  In  1969 NASAs budget was 2.65% In 2020 the NASA budget was 0.5%.  I doubt that the budget for space exploration will ever get up to the the levels in the 60s.

 

I read some stats that suggest that in 2018 the world spent 471 Billion on sport.  We could say "shouldn't we fix all the other problems before we put money into kicking a leather ball around"?      Of course there are benefits to sport (so I am led to believe) such as physical fitness and people (apparently) enjoy watching it and are sometimes inspired by it.    

 

Humans are naturally curious and have always wanted to know what was in the next valley or across that body of water and they have always innovated in order to travel into to that next valley or across the water.  I cant see that we have reached and end to our curiosity or our inventiveness.

 

    

[Old Koreelah]

43 minutes ago, pmccarthy said:

There can be no new elements. The periodic table is full, up to the highly unstable end.

I support the logic, but history tells us it’s dangerous to make such emphatic predictions.

 

1899: “Everything that can be invented has been invented."

- suggesting the US Patent Office would soon have to close.

 

 

A couple attributed to Bob Menzies:

there is no future in space rocketry or computers

-failing to support Australia’s pioneering role in those fields.

 

https://www.pcworld.com/article/155984/worst_tech_predictions.html

 

 

 

[octave]

If we substitute the word compounds for elements then we could make discoveries on the moon other planets. The periodic table is full except at the end where the elements are unstable and don't last very long before breaking down.

 

I do very much take the point though of thinking everything has been invented.  Many people are of the opinion that scientist playing with colliders are just wasting time and money .  Higgs Boson? but what can we use it for? Well at this point nothing practical but you never know where a discovery will lead.

 

[Jerry_Atrick]

18 hours ago, pmccarthy said:

There can be no new elements. The periodic table is full, up to the highly unstable end.

Well, theoretically, we can generate new synthetic elements using particle accelerators, but they would be so light, they would be torn apart in picoseconds or less. I think Japan is trying ti create Eeunium or some such name...  But for practical purposes, yep, it is full, and I should have used the term compounds.

[octave]

Getting closer to it's first flight.

 

Mars milestone: NASA Ingenuity helicopter survives first cold night alone

[willedoo]

On 28/03/2021 at 7:13 AM, octave said:

I think the idea of terraforming an uninhabitable planet to replace this one is crazy.  If you can terraform Mars then you can surely terraform Earth to solve any problems (other than asteroid etc.)  Having said that I am in favour of working towards a presence on other planets.   for the foreseeable future this would be like Antarctica, no one lives there full time it is more like an outpost where scientific research takes place.

octave, I see it as evolution of sorts. Every species of life is programmed to try to survive and adapt. Short term, it might seem odd to try to colonize Mars. But let's say, in theory, the human race survives a lot longer that we expect. All the planets are gradually getting sucked towards the sun and the time will come when this planet is too hot for any life to survive. By that time, Mars could be looking good for a while.

 

The type of possible lifestyle on Mars might seem dismal compared to what we know here and now, but later on down the track the human race might see it as a better alternative to extinction.

[facthunter]

The sun will expand to engulf the earth but that's a long time away. Most of the universe is a very hostile place with substances and temperatures we could not stand for a minute.  WE are OF this earth and must treat it respectfully. We are unlikely to find another adequate one let alone one better, or as good. Nev

[willedoo]

The U.S. is inching closer to rocket engine self sufficiency. This year, Russia is shipping the last six RD-180 engines to the U.S. under the current contract. The Atlas 5 which uses the RD-180, will be eventually be replaced by the Atlas 6 using the Blue Origin BE-4 engine. Last year the first BE-4 test engine was delivered to the United Launch Alliance.

 

It's said that the two single chamber BE-4 engines fitted to the Atlas 6 will develop more thrust than the single twin chambered RD-180 on the Atlas 5. The BE-4 is a methane burning engine and the Russian RD-180 kerosene burning. Energomash, the Russian company manufacturing rocket engines, has said that the RD-180 and RD-181 sales to the U.S. make up more than half the company's profits.

 

The RD-181 powers Northrup Grumman's Antares rocket. The original Antares engine was a redesign of the old Soviet NK-33. After the failure of that engine, the RD-181 was purchased from Russia for the Antares. Once the U.S. stops buying the RD-180 engine, some of the slack in sales might be taken up by India as they expand their space programme.

 

 

 

Edited April 10, 2021 by willedoo

[willedoo]

In other news, the latest Soyuz has docked, carrying two Russian cosmonauts and one American astronaut. The Soyuz was named for Yuri Gagarin to mark the sixty year anniversary of the first manned space flight. During their stay, the Russian cosmonauts will undock the Pirs module to make way for the long delayed Nauka laboratory module.

[Bruce Tuncks]

Personally, I like the idea of a moon colony better than a mars one. No weather is better than dust surely. And reliable solar power, plus cheaper freight to and from earth.

[willedoo]

I see that the Russians are using their new method of getting to the ISS; two orbits I think it is. From lift off in Kazakhstan to docking at the ISS, 3 hours 23 minutes.

[facthunter]

Sugar should be a good fuel .The engines would surely run a lot sweeter and there's a surplus of it. Nev