The Random thought thread

[old man emu]

I'm all for the reintroduction of the cubit.

[octave]

15 minutes ago, old man emu said:

I'm all for the reintroduction of the cubit.

I think we should definitely adopt the "smoot" unit of measurement.

 

Smoot (unit of measurement)

• Origin:

  The unit was created in October 1958 by Oliver R. Smoot and his Lambda Chi Alpha fraternity brothers at MIT. 

   
• Method:

  They measured the length of the Harvard Bridge by having Oliver Smoot lie down repeatedly, using his height as a human measuring stick. The bridge was measured to be 364.4 smoots, plus or minus an ear. 

• Legacy:

  The markings are still repainted annually and are even recognized by local authorities. The term was added to the American Heritage Dictionary in 2011, and Oliver R. Smoot went on to have a distinguished career in standards and measurement. 

   

   

  

   

   

   

 

[ClintonB]

[nomadpete]

1 hour ago, old man emu said:

I'm all for the reintroduction of the cubit.

Oh.

 

I thought the cubit was replaced by the ferkin (2 ferkins = one kilderkin)......

No, no no, wait. 

 

The common cubit is divided into 6 palms × 4 fingers = 24 digits.

 

That's exactly  1 ft 5+1⁄2 in to 1 ft 8+13⁄16 inches.

 

As you'd expect the Macedonian cubit was a bit short, being part of the EU. Their cubit is 14 inches.

 

I'm so glad we changed to standardised miles, yards,  roods, feet, inches and fractions.

 

Edited yesterday at 09:56 AM by nomadpete

[Marty_d]

16 hours ago, old man emu said:

I'm all for the reintroduction of the cubit.

They're reintroducing qubits in quantum computing.

[facthunter]

I hate the Lining up in a Queue BIT. I always get the FAR one.  Nev

[Marty_d]

I don't know if this merits a thread of its own, but I was pondering this the other day. Fairly randomly.

So anyway I saw one of those "Slow down for wildlife" signs with a cute picture of a wallaby or something on it, which is fine, but this one also had the words "My life is just as important as yours."

Now I call bullshit on that one, no wallaby's life is as important as a human's - but then I thought, can I justify that?  It's all very well having an opinion but I should be able to back it up.

 

This of course led to the thought that what IS the relative importance of various animal's lives?  I think we can all agree that all animal life is not equally valuable.  We will swat a mosquito or fly without thinking twice but we certainly wouldn't kill an elephant so casually.  And viruses - we not only kill them but consider it good and right to develop a bioweapon against them to kill them in their trillions.

 

And then there's the "what animal would you eat" scenario.  Some vegans hold the view that we shouldn't eat any animal, to which I say, well if chooks and pigs didn't want to be eaten, they shouldn't have evolved to taste so delicious.

But anyway, after considering my little flock of chickens for a while, and seeing that they truly are the stupidest creatures, I think the hierarchy has kind of crystallized in my mind a bit.

 

My personal set of values for what animals I would kill and eat (even if you're just buying them from the supermarket, you're just outsourcing the killing) - is impacted by the following.

• Does the animal have a developed set of emotions?  Ie does it display happiness, shame, loyalty, mournfulness, etc?  (Without trying to anthromorphise!)
  • This lets things like elephants, dogs and whales off my menu.
• Does the animal develop stable relationships and raise a small number of young with care?
  • So most things which either mate for life or have fairly stable relationships.  Eg penguins would not make it on my list.
  • You could argue that sheep and cows also have a small number of young and raise them with care, but I don't think they develop stable relationships, if you've ever seen a bull or ram in action.
• Does the animal have a high level of intelligence?
  • So again, whales, elephants, cockatoos and dogs are off the menu for me.
  • It can be argued that pigs are as intelligent as dogs, I never said this method was foolproof, but they evolved as yummy bacon instead of man's best friend.  Sucks for them.
• Does the animal resemble us? (some more than others!)
  • I would not eat a gorilla, chimp or orangutan (and not just because of Planet of the Apes).  And I'd find it hard to eat a smaller monkey as well.  Even that little prick in Pirates of the Caribbean.

So that's it really.  Anything not on those list of features is pretty much fair game.  Of course it has to taste nice and not be illegal as well.

 

All this is subject to the caveat that my ethics are malleable when it comes to hunger.  So if I'm literally in danger of starving, and Lassie has proved unreliable in getting help, she's in the pot.

 

In terms of the sign, as far as I know wallabies don't make the cut on that list above, but even if they did, in my mind they're still not as important as a human.  Even the animals that are high on the list are not as important as a human - we see that when a dog attacks people and is put down.  So I will try really hard NOT to hit a wallaby on the road, but if it's unavoidable, I will not lose sleep over it.

 

Now some biologist is going to tell me that scallops have a vibrant social life, and that chickens are the Einsteins of the bird world but just hide it REALLY well.

 

 

 

Edited 14 hours ago by Marty_d

[rgmwa]

I think most people in the western world would agree with you, but it’s certainly not universal. Cultural upbringing is a big factor in how humans treat other animals.

[Marty_d]

14 minutes ago, rgmwa said:

I think most people in the western world would agree with you, but it’s certainly not universal. Cultural upbringing is a big factor in how humans treat other animals.

Agree 100%.  That's why I made it very clear that it's just my personal viewpoint.

[facthunter]

There's no need to be cruel to anything Gratuously. Most things feel Pain, react to and show fear. Its a tragedy when a species Goes extinct. Nev

[red750]

Where do you put the likes of Chump on your list?

 

Sharks have no compunction eating humans, so I'm happy eating flake.

[Jerry_Atrick]

3 hours ago, Marty_d said:

My life is just as important as yours."

Now I call bullshit on that one

Well, it sort of depends on your viewpoint, doesn't it. As a species, generally, one procreates to ensure survivial of that species.. therefore to that species, that species life is most valuable.

 

At a macro level, though, the whole ecology has evolved such that most life forms are required to maintain the balance. Systemically, to tne environment, how valuable is each life form - even viruses? Very important would be the answer. For example. get rid of dingoes, and the land is destroyed - grasses gone, etc.. Why? Because dingoes do a better job of controlling the roo population from overgrazing the land than people. Infividually, a dingoe's life is unimportant.. but on scale, they become very important.  

 

On that basis, you would have to question whether human life at scale is really that important - in the numbers it is in and continues to grow relative to other life forms?

 

That is not to say we shouldn't continue the western notion of the sanctity of human life - in fact in western societies, there seems to be a natural  balancing act of reducing population through less reproduction (more practice, but less babies popping out).  

 

Other cultures thought, are developing at rabbit speed.

 

 

[Marty_d]

38 minutes ago, red750 said:

Where do you put the likes of Chump on your list?

 

Sharks have no compunction eating humans, so I'm happy eating flake.

Well, again, he's nominally human so off the menu.

Sharks are just another fish to me, so fair game.

22 minutes ago, Jerry_Atrick said:

Well, it sort of depends on your viewpoint, doesn't it. As a species, generally, one procreates to ensure survivial of that species.. therefore to that species, that species life is most valuable.

 

At a macro level, though, the whole ecology has evolved such that most life forms are required to maintain the balance. Systemically, to tne environment, how valuable is each life form - even viruses? Very important would be the answer. For example. get rid of dingoes, and the land is destroyed - grasses gone, etc.. Why? Because dingoes do a better job of controlling the roo population from overgrazing the land than people. Infividually, a dingoe's life is unimportant.. but on scale, they become very important.  

 

On that basis, you would have to question whether human life at scale is really that important - in the numbers it is in and continues to grow relative to other life forms?

 

That is not to say we shouldn't continue the western notion of the sanctity of human life - in fact in western societies, there seems to be a natural  balancing act of reducing population through less reproduction (more practice, but less babies popping out).  

 

Other cultures thought, are developing at rabbit speed.

 

 

Yes, you can take an absolute view of the argument.

But I think of it in practical terms. And I reckon this goes across cultures.

If you are in a situation where a person and an animal are both gravely injured, and you can save one but not both... Would you ever NOT pick the human?

(A normal random human you don't know. Does not include Trump/Netanyahu/Putin/Farage or Barnaby Joyce).

 

 

Edited 10 hours ago by Marty_d

[Jerry_Atrick]

Agree. .that was my point..

 

And I hate to say, it does include those you mentioned..

 

To then be locked up and slowly have pain inflicted on them... Revenge is best served cold.

[old man emu]

Recently I was driving along and spotted a goanna starting to move across the road from my right to left. At teh same time, two magpies were attacking it. Had it been trying to raid their nest??

 

Anyway, my first reaction was to stop so that I would not run over the goanna (country road, no following traffic). The goanna finsished crossing the road, and after one or two desultry swoops, the magpies flew back to their tree on teh other side of the road. 

 

Did I:

1. Do the goanna out of a feed?

2. Fail to prevent an attack on the nest at some time in teh future?

3. Condemn some other animal to death be a goanna who had missed out on a magpie egg omelette?

4. Ensure the continuation of that goanna's genetic diversity should it have found a mate?

[pmccarthy]

I eat meat. But when I am walking, if I can avoid stepping on an ant, I avoid it. 

[onetrack]

The magpies were attacking the goanna, because that's what magpies do, they defend their "territory".