2022 Victorian State Election

[Jerry_Atrick]

Ahhh yeah… oops

[red750]

Unfortunately, as my daughter commented, Matthew Guy has the charisma of a sock. We need to go back to Jeff Kennet to find a Lib leader anyone can remember.

 

Who remembers the last Lib premier, Dennis Napthine? Forgot his name, didn't you?

[facthunter]

No!. Naptime the Veterinarian.I even wrote to him personally about Puppy Farms (Waste of time). I thought Ted Ballieu was ok and Rupert Hamer. .  Nev

[red750]

In a week, Andrews will have been Premier for 8 years, and now extended till 12 years. Still a long way to go to beat Liberal Premier Henry Bolte, who was premier for 17 years, 1955 till 1972. Rupert Hamer (Lib) held the position for 9 years, 1972 till 1981. 

[onetrack]

I must say, I'm absolutely staggered at the Victorian election results, and it only goes to show how useless the other parties and politicians up for election that lost, were.

 

I reckon a lot of this anti-Liberal voting is simply people thoroughly sick of the Morrison Govt manipulation and incompetence, and the too-cosy closeness of big business and the Liberal Party.

 

The general thrust against inflation by the Liberals is to block any wage and salary increases - while businesses can ramp up their charges wholesale, without any impediment.

 

The Libs argue that inflation comes from excessive wage and salary increases - but the truth is that inflation comes from companies putting prices up excessively, and recording massive increases in profits, accordingly. The level of profit increases reported by companies in the last financial year is mind boggling - 30% and 40% increases in profits, in many cases.

 

The Nurses in W.A. are now on a war footing with the W.A. Labor Govt for increased pay levels - and I don't blame them. However, the McGowan Govt is turning very Liberal-like in its attitude to pay increases for the nurses, and is refusing to negotiate any decent increases.

 

I can see a lot more of this industrial action happening across the nation soon, as employees come to the realisation they've been conned with recent historical wage and salary increases, and conditions that have never kept up with inflation - which is still increasing.

[facthunter]

Wages freeze equals a wage cut over time. You create a working POOR like the USA. Keeping wages DOWN was LNP govt POLICY.. That's proven. Nev

[Bruce Tuncks]

So, its the Lib's policy to increase inequality huh? But inequality has a big effect on gdp, in the negative way.

I wonder how they will cope with that.

 Wow they need more talent in their lineup, I agree with Jerry that they really should have done a lot better.

 

Edited November 27, 2022 by Bruce Tuncks

[facthunter]

It starts at the level of preselection of candidates. There's been attempts to have some "infiltration of the ranks of Liberals for a while now.  Nev

[red750]

MSN News reporting Matthew Guy to resign as leader after second electoral loss.

[facthunter]

That's what normally happens.  Nev

[old man emu]

2 hours ago, facthunter said:

You create a working POOR like the USA.

How's this for an attempt at a logical argument?

 

Mr Big Bucks is the CEO of a company and earns a motza. Time is money, so we can work out how many dollars per hour he is paid. 

Mr Big Bucks is a very busy man, but he likes the lawns around his dwelling to be well kept. He cannot allocate his own time to mowing, so he engaged Col'n to mow them. 

If Mr Big Bucks diverted time from his CEO job to mow the lawns, you could would out how much it cost him to do the mowing. Since Col'n is substituting for him on the mowing front, shouldn't Col'n be paid at the same hourly rate as Mr Big Bucks would be paid during that hour?

[facthunter]

The Mr BB's of the world consider them selves to merit Rock Star remuneration. The lovely GINA thinks $2 a day is about right for a mineworker from Remotistan.  Just what HUMAN is WORTH say over a cuppla million. Really.   Nev

[willedoo]

I heard on the wireless this morning that the swings to the Liberals were mainly in safe Liberal seats and not the marginals. So is it a case of preaching to the converted or just bad luck?

 

A quote from retiring Labor MP, Martin Pakula:

“Framing an entire election campaign around the theory (hope?) that everyone hates Dan as much as you hate Dan was always a Hail Mary strategy. It’s hard to hear the community clearly when you spend all your time in an echo chamber."

 

I don't know anything about Victorian politics, but here in Queensland, by the time Labor finishes the current four year term, the LNP will have served one term in almost thirty years. It's not that Labor is that good; the problem is the Qld. LNP have a lot of dills on their team, and very uninspiring policies when they happen to think one up. I think it's a combination of lack of talent and a party that needs a good shake up from within.

 

There are some well intentioned LNP members in Qld., but they can't get anywhere with all the other deadheads on the parliamentary team and within the party organisation. The majority are still trying to live in the past while the electorate has moved on. These days Queensland is a state with heavy interstate migration and the demographics are very different from thirty years ago. The LNP hasn't figured that out yet. They still think that what won elections for Joh will get them back in power a generation later.

[willedoo]

14 minutes ago, old man emu said:

How's this for an attempt at a logical argument?

ome, somehow I don't think that one will fly.

[facthunter]

Crispychickenson of Manila and Canavan the Tradie or Miner look alike. What tools?  Nev

[willedoo]

15 minutes ago, old man emu said:

How's this for an attempt at a logical argument?

 

Mr Big Bucks is the CEO of a company and earns a motza. Time is money, so we can work out how many dollars per hour he is paid. 

Mr Big Bucks is a very busy man, but he likes the lawns around his dwelling to be well kept. He cannot allocate his own time to mowing, so he engaged Col'n to mow them. 

If Mr Big Bucks diverted time from his CEO job to mow the lawns, you could would out how much it cost him to do the mowing. Since Col'n is substituting for him on the mowing front, shouldn't Col'n be paid at the same hourly rate as Mr Big Bucks would be paid during that hour?

And by the same logic, if I'm earning $20 per hour, then a dentist should work on my teeth for $20 per hour.

[spacesailor]

SO ! .

The head oncho of. McQuarrie bank.  $ 53 million PA. ( without bonuses  ).

Who Can work those numbers into dollars per hour . At 40 hours a week .

spacesailor

 

 

[nomadpete]

3 hours ago, willedoo said:

There are some well intentioned LNP members in Qld., but they can't get anywhere with all the other deadheads on the parliamentary team and within the party

And that is why (in all partys) an increasing number are leaving their party and running as independants.

 

Party politics is anti democratic. If parties were banned, all mp's could vote according to their conscience, on every issue.

Edited November 27, 2022 by nomadpete

[Jerry_Atrick]

One of the other things about the LNP is that the section of society it draws from - corporate and business, do much better outside of politics than in... So, for a small fee, they can get access to government when the libs are in, rather than subject themselves to public scrutiny of being in the party...

[Jerry_Atrick]

I am not defending the magnitude of pay.. but you can't measure a CEO or exec director's pay by 40 hours.. The job has a number of facets that most shop floor jobs do not have:

• They are effectively working 24x7; I had the "pleasure" of seeing the CEO of a bank "working" and it is literally a commitment of life and family to it. There is virtually nothing in their life outside the business - even on holidays, etc. It is all consuming. Even for the shop floor employee that works long hours, when they clock off, they generally clock off (they may spend spare time educating or other career progression activities, but that is a personal choice, not a demand of the job).
• They are legally liable not only for their own actions, but the actions of anyone under them - all the way to the shop floor. This is in theory and I am not aware of a banking CEO that has been convicted in Aus for a trader's market abuse, but it certainly has happened here, where the bank was found to have inadequate controls despite the regulatory team reporting to the board of all the controls were in place (apparently, the CEO had access to the information if they looked, and that was good enough.. By definition, the CEO has access to all a bank's information - but it is impractical for them to review everything. And these obligations are impossible to insure for. I had to remind a capital markets CEO last week that he is on the hook for compliance - not the compliance team.
• It can end your career, and even send you broke (although the latter is insurable and companies will often indemnify or pay for the insurance). If something goes wrong on your watch, even if it was shown it was hidden from you, the board can fire you with no notice or golden parachute negotiated. If that causes loss to a third party and the bank is sued, they can compel the director to pay (this is in company law in Aus, as well), which can send you broke. And, don't expect to get a job, at least at that level again. It did happen to a CEO of capital markets of a bank I worked at, where there were some shenanigans that not only did he not know about, but was hidden from him; he had his licence stripped from him and was barred from working in Financial Services.

 

These are some of the reasons you can't compare a 40 hour work week to the salary of a CEO or other exec directors - We can argue whether they really suffer the consequences of their actions or incompetence.. and I agree, a hell of a lot of them get away with a hell of a lot of things they shouldn't - or are rewarded for less than mediocre employment.. .We can also argue the quantum of their base salary relative to the facets of their job... But we can't simply divide their weekly salary by 40 and arrive at a cost per hour worked. It doesn't work that way.

[spacesailor]

SO ! .

When  my father asked my bro & I to become his henchmen , as company directors. 

He said " it is a Tax avoidance ", and we get a new car for free .

Just to skim the higher profits , so less tax payable. 

No shareholders to lose money to.

spacesailor

 

[Marty_d]

1 hour ago, Jerry_Atrick said:

But we can't simply divide their weekly salary by 40 and arrive at a cost per hour worked. It doesn't work that way.

Ok.  Less than 6 hours of sleep a night is generally considered to be unhealthy and unsustainable so let's give them 6 hours sleep.

Eating, toilet, showering, shaving, shagging, some basic interaction with the family, even if they don't cook or clean for themselves there'd be interaction with the staff who do.  So let's take another hour for that.

We're now looking at 17 hours per day, 7 days a week, which I would argue is giving them way too much credit.  No one lives their job 17 hours a day, 7 days a week, no matter what they do.

In any case that's 119 hours a week.  Even if they don't get their 2 weeks leave on their yacht, at 52 weeks a year, for our joker on 53m a year, that's $8,564.96 per HOUR. 

I'm sorry, but the vague possibility of carrying the can if one of your staff stuffs up (and literally, how many times does that actually happens to CEO's?) - is not worth nearly ten grand an hour.  No one is worth that.

 

I would argue that if any human on the planet is getting more than $1m a year then they are overpaid.

 

[onetrack]

Then there's the case that if someone is overworking themselves to that extent, then they're a serious risk to the company, because of the mismanagement of their health and time.

Overtired people make bad decisions, we see that time and time again. So they should be appointing some one else to do half their "menial" work, so they can concentrate their normal time available on the important corporate decisions and oversight.

 

I've seen one nephew working his a*** off for a company around 20 yrs ago, doing a fantastic job as a senior manager. But he was getting run ragged with company demands, and a need to be everywhere at once.

So he told them he was going to "pull the pin". He was already on $150K a year, so they offered him $200K to stay.

But he knew that if he took that offer, he'd have more responsibility and work piled onto him - so he said, "No thanks, I've made my mind up, I'm gone from here".

The stupid part is - the company wouldn't let him hire a subordinate to ease his load - but when he actually left, they ended up having to hire two people to do what he previously did! 

 

Edited November 27, 2022 by onetrack

[red750]

Back to the Vic election. Despicable Dan only got 51% of the 1st preference votes in his electorate, 60% on preferences. One candidate standing against him was a Kim Jong Un impersonator, who gained 76 votes.

 

Two months ago, our electoral boundaries were redrawn, and we were included with Glen Waverley. The sitting member for Glen Waverley (ALP) beat the sitting member (Lib, now departed) for Forest Hill by 11 1st preference votes. On preferences, ALP won by 5.5%.

[red750]

One of the problems faced by the Liberals, and to a lesser extent, the ALP, is that their constituency is in the older age group that is dwindling. The millenials are voting for independents and minor parties like Companions and Pets Party, Transport Matters Party, Derryn Hinch's Justice Party, Fiona Patten's Reason Party, etc.

 

The Sack Dan Andrews Party gave its preferences to .. guess who?  Dan Andrews and the ALP.