From other site...WIND TURBINES

[facthunter]

IF the room was sweating, it would. The energy from the fans will have a heating effect. All energy dissipates as heat, finally. Nev

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

IF the room was sweating, it would. The energy from the fans will have a heating effect. All energy dissipates as heat, finally. Nev

I tried to explain that to him. In vain.

 

He also warned me once, when we were driving, that he might be taken up at any time...

 

 

[facthunter]

I wouldn't have thought that a bloke like would have many fans at all. Nev

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

He had other, redeeming features.

 

 

[Geoff13]

I have just done some deliveries to a solar farm site.

 

198 Acres for 75 MegaWatts of power.

 

I would hate to be footing the bill for the construction.

 

 

[nomadpete]

I note a lot of criticism of the taxpayer subsiding renewable energy - wind turbines or solar.

 

Why aren't these same people equally upset about the amount of taxpayer subsidy that we pay to the coal industry? There sure isn't a level playing field.

 

ABC News item:

 

"A new report finds exploration by coal and energy companies is subsidised by Australian taxpayers by as much as $US3.5 billion ($4 billion) every year in the form of direct spending and tax breaks.

 

The report, "The Fossil Fuel Bailout", by the Overseas Development Institute and Oil Change International estimates that G20 countries are subsidising oil, gas and coal explorers to the tune of $US88 billion ($100 billion) annually through grants, loans, and tax deductions.

 

The report said that the United States and Australia paid the highest level of national subsidies for exploration in the form of direct spending or tax breaks."

 

 

[nomadpete]

And it looks like the coal industry gets quite a nice legup from us, note also that the coal industry is about 80% foreign owned. Why are we taxpayers funding assistance to foreign companies?:

 

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[facthunter]

I'm no friend of the Coal Industry but the diesel rebate is only In respect of OFF road use. Farmers get it too but IF you are not ON the road why should you pay a tax for use of roads? Nev

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

An article well worth reading, especially the excellent insights in the comments section.

 

(Can't seem to get it to link, so copy and paste the following into your search space:)

 

It's all about vested interests': untangling conspiracy, conservatism and climate scepticism

 

Graham Readfearn

 

 

[coljones]

I'm no friend of the Coal Industry but the diesel rebate is only In respect of OFF road use. Farmers get it too but IF you are not ON the road why should you pay a tax for use of roads? Nev

That doesn't stop it being a subsidy.

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

That doesn't stop it being a subsidy.

How so, Col? On-road fuel is taxed to pay for roadworks. Why should fuel that is not used on road be so taxed?

 

 

[nomadpete]

The diesel rebate pales into insignificance when you consider the "rehabilitation" subsidy. Why can't the coal industry do it's own? It should be part of the cost of the coal, not a taxpayer expense.

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

Didn't know about that subsidy, Pete. Australia is littered with old mine sites that haven't been rehabilitated. Perhaps the worst are not those left by big corporations, but abandoned holes in the ground left by individuals. Some have been part-filled and covered over, only to subside decades later. People and animals still fall down them.

 

 

[kgwilson]

The Henry Review recommended a tax of 40 per cent on what it termed the super-profits of mining companies.But when Kevin Rudd announced the tax, he met with a massive, well-funded campaign against it from the mining industry.

 

The final form of the mining tax, adopted under Prime Minister Julia Gillard, is the mineral resource rent tax (MRRT) which is levied on coal and iron ore only and at a much lower rate.

 

The Federal Government projection was for the tax to raise $3 billion in the first year alone, much of which was allocated and spent in advance.

 

However, the manner in which companies met the tax requirement, which included write-downs of major asset values, led to only a paltry $200 million being collected so far this year.

 

And there's a very real chance that much of that will be refunded back to the companies which paid it in advance.

 

Despite what can only be considered its abject failure, there are no plans by Labor to change the format or criteria of the MRRT.

 

The politics of the mining tax

 

Whilst wind is not the total solution to powering our country to suggest that you would wind farms all over Victoria to charge a battery is total nonsense. Perhaps you could supply the figures you have used to determine that? Earlier you said "batteries flat in SA again" this was false I went straight to Hornsdale Power Reserve

 

It is important to understand what the batteries in SA are for. One of the reasons for high prices is that we are somewhat captive to the energy market. The wholesale price for electricity changes in In 30-minute blocks when demand is high the price skyrockets (see graph on the link I have provided) at this point the grid sources its power from the cheapest supply whether it be gas, wind solar coal etc. This high price may only last for 30 minutes and this is where the battery comes in.

 

As far as average consumption goes, Neil I am not sure what point you are trying to make. Happy to share my average consumption though

 

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Costs us about $5 to $6 a day to keep warm or cool cook our meals heat our water run our dishwasher watch tv run 3 computers have as much light as we need and as we are renovating run power tools. When bills get higher then I take action because I am in control of my life. I either look for more power efficient solutions or cut my cloth to suit my budget ie just use less, switch off appliances that do not need to be left on standby etc.

I have a 2 kW solar system on the roof. Our house is a modern fully insulated brick & tile place & we are a 2 person household. Over summer I had the air conditioning on quite a lot and our daily consumption from the grid was just on 8kW a day. The only gas I have is the BBQ. Cooking is by induction & fan oven. One large fridge/freezer & 1 large upright freezer. Front load washer & dryer. Water is heated by a heat pump which runs mostly during the day using solar. It draws around 800W when running flat out. Winter is similar as lights etc on longer & some heating (reverse cycle) Spring is the lowest at around 7kW a day. My TV is quite inefficient as it is an original Plasma I bought in 2005 & it refuses to die. It's on 5-8 hours a day. There are 2 computers & router on most of the time or in sleep mode, 10 appliances (clocks, microwave, phones, oven, TV, modem, foxtel box etc) in standby mode at all times when not in use. We only light where we are & these are all fluoro or LED. My solar system produces around 260kWh a month & I export between 40% & 45% of this. Off peak usage is about 60% of the total usage with peak & shoulder around 20% each.

 

The solar has paid for itself from reduced bills about 6 months ago since it was installed in May 2014. If I was doing it today I'd install a 5kW system as it is the same price as I paid for my 2kW system & I reckon my peak/shoulder would drop to about 20% or less of imported power. Imported peak power costs 31.7c, shoulder 30.8c & off peak 18.2c. I get 11.1c for power I export.

 

So there you have it. Largest quarterly bill $237.97, smallest $154.52.

 

My neighbour across the road, working family with 2 kids, no solar, just got a power bill of $980.00 for the same period.

 

 

[spacesailor]

"rehabilitation" subsidy"

 

Can A individual get these subsidies if they are willing to clean up what's out there.

 

I know of unemployed that would love a "good wage" for doing what they & lot's of other's are doing voluntary. 4W4 clubs adopting road's to keep the highways clean & going into National-Parks to assist there.

 

That's just one group who would do it better if money came in for equipment. And don't forget the SES & rural fire service.

 

spacesailor

 

 

[nomadpete]

I have lived in a location where mine subsidence was a "normal" part of life. The mining companies would try to get a signature on the agreement to accept some limited liability as long as the claimant abandoned all subsequent claims to compensation. As a home owner that had sudden subsidence, how could I foresee what damage that the future would be reveal?

 

The mining companies were trying to minimise their risk. To the detriment of the home owner.

 

 

[nomadpete]

In the capatalist paradigm, those who volunteer to do good for the public are fools because they were not paid to do it.

 

Don't expect anyone to be grateful.

 

The big coal companies are happy to declare bankruptcy when it comes time to rehabilitate the mess they leave.

 

So the government (you and me) pick up the tab to clean up (rehabilitate).

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

I have lived in a location where mine subsidence was a "normal" part of life. The mining companies would try to get a signature on the agreement to accept some limited liability as long as the claimant abandoned all subsequent claims to compensation. As a home owner that had sudden subsidence, how could I foresee what damage that the future would be reveal?The mining companies were trying to minimise their risk. To the detriment of the home owner.

Yonks ago we trained with Newcastle Police Rescue Squad, and they had stories of dogs disappearing down huge holes that appeared under houses. Scary.

 

 

[nomadpete]

I lived across the lake (Lake Macquarie) from a couple of mines. Many houses around me had subsidence problems. The mines were very active trying to minimise their responsibility.

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

In the capatalist paradigm, those who volunteer to do good for the public are fools because they were not paid to do it.

Don't expect anyone to be grateful.

 

The big coal companies are happy to declare bankruptcy when it comes time to rehabilitate the mess they leave.

 

So the government (you and me) pick up the tab to clean up (rehabilitate).

Time to trot this out again:

 

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[nomadpete]

Brutal but true

 

 

[Marty_d]

Why are we taxpayers funding assistance to foreign companies?

Because we're lazy, stupid, and complacent.

 

Just like the LNP's proposed tax cuts for big business, which will flow straight into the pockets of overseas investors.

 

 

[coljones]

How so, Col? On-road fuel is taxed to pay for roadworks. Why should fuel that is not used on road be so taxed?

It is all in the nomenclature. Roads are paid for out of consolidated revenue. All governments have been tricky about what pays for what.

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

True of course Col, but it doesn't change the fact that the surcharge helps pay for roadworks, just like the Medicare levy helped repair cyclone damage. Why should fuel burned off our roads be levied?

 

 

[facthunter]

IF you value transparency and justice the Diesel rebate is not a subsidy. The express purpose is for roadworks though the corresponding petrol equivalent some goes to consolidated revenue. so perhaps the diesel does also. IN New Zealand they had a counter on one wheel and you had to do a return and send a corresponding amount of money IF you used Diesel on road. Lawn mowers, diggers and pumps generators etc HERE all pay the cost which again is NOT what the impost was supposed to be used for. The NZ system was cumbersome but true to purpose. Nev