Aussie Federal election 2025

[Grumpy Old Nasho]

On 05/05/2025 at 11:01 PM, rgmwa said:

even though your curse seems to be be taking a while to work against people who actually had nothing to do with you being conscripted. 

Kevin Rudd had nothing to do with the Stolen Generations, but he and Labor still apologized to the Aboriginal People.

[Grumpy Old Nasho]

On 05/05/2025 at 9:55 PM, red750 said:

Same old same old. Maybe you have a bone to pick, but what were they supposed to do, just let the commies march down and take over here? Then you'd really have something to bitch about.

LOL yeah I bet 80% of Australia's population was really concerned about that. You're funny!

[Jerry_Atrick]

5 hours ago, Grumpy Old Nasho said:

Kevin Rudd had nothing to do with the Stolen Generations, but he and Labor still apologized to the Aboriginal People.

I was going to scoff at this, but on reflection, GON has a point. Of course, the scale is different, and his conscription and subsequent life problems are on a different scale to that of the first nations peoples, but it doesn't alter the facts that:

• It was a systematic dispossession of an intrinsic part of his being.
• It was applied to a population
• It has had devastating ongoing effects
• For some, if not many, it is alleged conscription was illegally performed (there was an article about a Nash taking the Aussie government to court as he was conscripted despite his birth date never been selected): https://www.smh.com.au/national/his-birthday-wasn-t-picked-from-the-barrel-he-was-conscripted-anyway-20250321-p5lldq.html
• At least for some time, there was discrimination and vilification of Nashos.

 

I don't recall GON blaming Albo or his immediate PM predecessors of both stripes.. but he was laying blame in the Aussie government. I don't think too many first nations peoples today blame the current government, or Rudd, or even his immediate predecessors.. but it would be a nice gesture if the Aussie government did apologise, without prejudice, for any transgressions and for disrupting or ruining their lives....

 

GON, OT, my uncle Daryl, and all of them, I salute your sacrifice!

 

 

Edited Tuesday at 07:30 PM by Jerry_Atrick

[octave]

There was a belated welcome home parade in Sydney in 1987. I know this because I took part in it as a musician in the RAAF band. From memory Hawke gave a speech. I believe there were about 2000 vets marching. I am not saying this is enough but times have changed somewhat. 

Edited Tuesday at 09:28 PM by octave

[rgmwa]

10 hours ago, Grumpy Old Nasho said:

Kevin Rudd had nothing to do with the Stolen Generations, but he and Labor still apologized to the Aboriginal People.

The Aboriginal People didn’t put a curse on Rudd and the Labor party to try to get him to apologise. 

[old man emu]

Before the election, I was proposing that the young voters would have a big impact on the results. I thought that they would be supporting the Party which had the strongest policies regarding environmental matters, both locally and globally. That would have suggested that the Greens would increase their numbers in the Lower House. Now we know how the Greens did, I must admit that my thought was incorrect. 

 

It would appear that the Young People were either seeking the security of a Party that had many of their interests in common, or else, they were turning away from Parties that had little interest in the Young People. Perhaps, too, they saw the Greens as being incapable of mounting a strong voice against either of the other two main sides. 

[Marty_d]

The Green vote has only decreased something like 0.5% overall since the last election - and that one was their biggest ever.

They're saying that the reason this didn't translate to seats is because LNP preferenced Labor over Green.

[facthunter]

It looks like Adam Bandt is gone. To some, their bashing of Labor had a Dutton feel/ aspect to it. Their Total vote didn't change much. Looks as though Palmers ventures into Politics are over. . Nev

[Marty_d]

56 minutes ago, facthunter said:

Looks as though Palmers ventures into Politics are over. . Nev

Something extremely satisfying about the silly bastard dropping $60m and getting nothing for it. Apparently the Legalize Marijuana party spent about $6,000 (1/10,000th) and got almost the same number of votes.

[facthunter]

It was about bashing Labor and expecting "considerations" from The LNP about getting his "Stranded Asset coal to port.  Nev

[red750]

It has been confirmed that Bandt has lost his seat. And Zoe Daniel, TEALs, in Goldstein danced too early. She lost to Tim Wilson, Liberal. He held the seat from 2018 to 2021 when he lost it to Daniel, but won it back on postal votes.

[pmccarthy]

Bandt the antisemite should be in jail.

[nomadpete]

Anti Netanyahu/Israel is not (according to many Australian Jews) the same thing as antisemite.

 

Maybe Bant just didn't like the number of innocents getting killed.

[old man emu]

I think that the "anti-Semite" label is applied too easily when reacting to the actions of the government of Israel. Isn't the situation in Israel more of a civil war, or war of independence, or preservation of an ancient homeland?

 

Compare the colonisation of Australia with the establishment of the State of Israel. Europeans came to a land uninvited and set up a system using the advantage of better organisation. Something similar happened when the displaced European Jews moved into Palestine post-WWII. Note that the area at that time was known by one and all as Palestine, implying that it was the home of the Palestinians who were of the Islamic faith, plus a few Jews and Christians. 

 

The Palestinians, having been shafted by the French and British after WWI, and more so after WWII, naturally arced up. But the Palestinians, having been a subjected subjugation for centuries by the Ottomans and then being "invaded" by people backed by the big powers, were unable to halt the takeover. The takeover did not seem to provide any benefits to the Palestinians. In fact, the more of the newcomers there were, the greater the losses the Palestinians suffered. 

 

What the Israeli government is doing is unacceptable to the civilised world. They are cracking walnuts with a sledgehammer. To call the Israeli government out for its actions is not being anti-Semitic. It is exactly the same as what has been done many times before, and in fact, isn't the condemnation of Russia's actions in the Ukraine much the same thing?

[Jerry_Atrick]

Whilst I don't agree with the jail bit, I am of the same opinion as @pmccarthy that Bandt, or the Greens official position seems anti-semetic or at least out of context.

 

For reference, here is the Green's policy: https://greens.org.au/campaigns/palestine

 

It places a hell of a lot of long term demands on the Israelis, and rigorous international enforcement. Yet it only requires the Palestinians to return the hostages and there be a trial of the "perpetrators" of the October 7 attack. So, let's unpack that.. First, there is only accountability of the foot soldiers of Hamas, and not the leadership.. nor the call for an internationally recognised terrorist organisation to be dismantled. Or it is an admission that Hamas is Palestine and vice versa.. in other words the authoritative representative of the people. Hmmm...

 

And then there is the demand to return lands since the '67 war. They don't recognise there was a major war perpetrated against Israel in 1978 and then many skirmishes since.. If you perpetrate violence on another country, you run the risk of losing, and losing territory. And, in this case Israel gave back a lot of territory they won in the 67 war, only to have it all happen again, so they took the land and subsequent and after 78 and subsequent skirmishes.. And apparently Arafat was offered 95% of the West Bank back in a peace deal, but refused - according to Jimmy Carter, I think.

 

If you look at Israel's reaction to the attacks, they have maintained from a very early stage.. release the hostages and disarm/dismantle Hamas, and they will walk away. They are going for their hostages - As a country at war, under the Geneva convention, the only duty of care they owe an enemy's citizens (in the enemy's territory) is to not specifically target them.. The Geneva convention acknowledges under a military pursuit, there will be civilian casualties but does not put an onus on either side to minimise them. Then ask yourself, which of the two targeted civilians against an enemy that clearly delineates its citizens, and which of the two know that the other would (has an obligation to) retaliate and recover hostages   and choose to hide behind its own citizens?

 

Yet there is no mention of Palestine having to commit to peace, either?

 

So, as a policy, it does seem a little ignorant of many facts, and either pro Palestinian or anti-semetic.. you choose.

 

So, yeah, Jews definitely are not happy with Netanyahu and Israel.. Most because of many things prior to October 7 revolving around corruption, the failures leasing up to it, and the initial response. No doubt many are critical of his strategy and apparent overreach, but few would be critical of him going to get the hostages.

 

[old man emu]

39 minutes ago, Jerry_Atrick said:

No doubt many are critical of his strategy and apparent overreach, but few would be critical of him going to get the hostages.

Many times hostages have been recovered by planned operations which directed the recovery operations to specific places. Bin Laden and Hussein were caught without the harm inflicted on the whole population. The Israeli government's idea seems to be that every single Palestinian is an active member of Hamas, so is a legitimate target to be destroyed by whatever means available. Isn't that an echo of the policy of the government of Germany from 1933 to 1945? Isn't that why the survivors of that German policy ask the rest of the world not to forget?

[facthunter]

 You got a Like but the "Hussein without without harm inflicted" is Not right. IRAQ is still a mess, and there never was any WMD's. KURDS are still persecuted. Netanyahu has killed a Lot of innocent people and wants all of GAZA  with NO Palestinian there. Nev

[Jerry_Atrick]

Ultimately, neither Bin Laden nor Hussein were hiding behind civilians..

 

How is Afghanistan today?

 

20 minutes ago, facthunter said:

Netanyahu has killed a Lot of innocent people and wants all of GAZA  with NO Palestinian there. Nev

That may be the case after October 7, but before? All evidence points to the opposite 

 

Don't forget he has continually stated he will withdraw troops on two conditions.. 1) return of the hostages and 2) disarmament of Hamas. Why doesn't the world exert the same pressure to Hamas to rest Netanyahu?

[facthunter]

Half of Israel doesn't like what Netanyahu is doing. Egypt warned Netanyahu that something big was going to happen. The day  after the  war stops, HE will be in front of a  Court. Nev

[nomadpete]

In my opinion, BOTH sides (Palestinian & Israel) need to be metaphorically grabbed by the scruff of the neck and given a shake.

 

Further, other countries should starve BOTH sides of weaponry. Otherwise they are supporting atrocities against civilians - probably because of hidden interests.

 

Wiping out the whole population of one country is the most uncivilised way ttotry to stop a conflict.

[spacesailor]

Disarmament of Israel was tried ! .

So they made their own , and better, than most other arms of the time .

spacesailor

[Grumpy Old Nasho]

On 07/05/2025 at 10:19 AM, rgmwa said:

The Aboriginal People didn’t put a curse on Rudd and the Labor party to try to get him to apologise. 

How would you know? They have their equivalent of witch doctors, called "Kadaitcha" men. Cursing people is their specialty.