Housing Shortage

[red750]

Works fine on my laptop.

[Marty_d]

It's not an app, just a webpage,  so I can't think of why it wouldn't load.

Tried from your phone or another device?

[onetrack]

I never spoken or written a bad word against realestate.com.au anywhere. And yes, I've tried accessing it on my Toshiba laptop (Win 7), and it won't load there, either.

I have found quite a few websites where others are complaining the real estate website won't load for them. I can't even contact their webmaster.

[facthunter]

It loads straight away. Check your security settings?  Nev

[onetrack]

Security settings are the standard default settings that come with Windows 11. Does MS think realestate.com.au is a scam site? They might be right!!

 

EDIT - Ahhhh!! Here's something interesting. I clicked on Willies link, and reset all the site permissions on the realestate.com.au site this morning, while it was attempting to load - and Windows tell you to reload the page, straight after you've done that - but when I reloaded the page, the site still wouldn't load.

 

So I left it all day and clicked on Willies link again, just a minute ago - and still the same result, it wouldn't load.

So ... I deleted the Tassie property address part of the URL, so it just read, "realestate.com.au" - and the home page of the website promptly loaded up!

 

I obviously wasn't holding my tongue right all this time!

 

Then I clicked on Willies link again - and the site refuses to load his link!! So ... I go to their home page, type in "Upper Castra" in their search menu - and the site refuses to load again!! Arrrrghhh!!!

 

Edited February 17 by onetrack

[willedoo]

If you have javascript disabled on your browser you just get a blank page.

[onetrack]

I did have javascript disabled on the realestate site last year, but activated it again while I was still running Windows 7. I went through all the site permissions this morning, looking for anything that might stop it loading, and the only one I could see that might cause trouble was, "block sites that are not secure". 

 

As a fair number of worthwhile websites run with out of date security certificates, I thought maybe that was the case with the realestate site - so I reset all the permissions to default and allowed insecure sites to load. But it still didn't seem to help, although I can access their home page now, which is more than I ever could previously.

[onetrack]

I've done some more testing, and found that the realestate.com.au site works just fine for me (including the search menu), if I use MS Edge browser.

 

But I rarely use MS Edge, I use Chrome 99.9% of the time. So it appears there's a conflict between Chrome and the realestate.com.au site.

 

I did also change the Chrome site permissions to allow pop-ups and redirects, but still no joy with their website.  I'll see if I can contact their webmaster.

[Jerry_Atrick]

It's a murdoch site, anyway.. So don't try too hard. Sadly, it is better than domain.com.au

[nomadpete]

Regarding housing affordability.....

 

ABC article reports:

 

"More than one in four residential properties purchased in New South Wales, Victoria and Queensland last year were paid for entirely with cash by older Australians, making them immune to interest rate hikes and propping up the housing market."

 

How can housing be "unaffordable", when there are so many cash buyers? The article suggests that older people are cashed up, but I doubt that the stats actually have the ages of buyers available to support the claim. Anyway, even if true, wouldn't it  suggest thes buyers have just sold the family home, thus not changing the number of available houses on the market?

 

There is something missing from the story. Perhaps it would be interesting to discover what percentage of private dwellings are purchased with overseas cash. Or am I just looking for a conspiracy theory?

[spenaroo]

1 hour ago, nomadpete said:

Regarding housing affordability.....

 

ABC article reports:

 

"More than one in four residential properties purchased in New South Wales, Victoria and Queensland last year were paid for entirely with cash by older Australians, making them immune to interest rate hikes and propping up the housing market."

 

How can housing be "unaffordable", when there are so many cash buyers? The article suggests that older people are cashed up, but I doubt that the stats actually have the ages of buyers available to support the claim. Anyway, even if true, wouldn't it  suggest thes buyers have just sold the family home, thus not changing the number of available houses on the market?

 

There is something missing from the story. Perhaps it would be interesting to discover what percentage of private dwellings are purchased with overseas cash. Or am I just looking for a conspiracy theory?

My parents have changed to self managed super.

by law it has to be invested and cant just sit in the bank.

 

they have 8 investment properties (2 bedroom units mostly) purchased over the last 5 years.

all done in cash from super.

when I was looking at units for $400k there was always a full inspection and multiple offers above advertised price to vendors before. (agents were straight up, they knew it was sold no matter what - so why bother creating a fake narrative)
property was usually off the market in 3 days.

my $440k house though (advertised at $480k) I was the only one to put an offer in...

Edited March 12 by spenaroo

[Marty_d]

Well that probably answers your question Peter - self managed super.

 

It's still unaffordable for young people though because you don't have those assets until the later stages of your career, if you're lucky.

Some in the LNP still think it's a good idea for people to be able to access super early to pay for houses.  However it's not, for two reasons.  Most importantly, super is a compounding interest product, so if you pull out a substantial amount relatively early in your working life, the amount you're losing for retirement is massive.  From a personal perspective that's bad, but also from a societal / economic perspective because that person will most likely be partially/fully supported by the age pension instead of self funded.

Secondly, if there's already a housing shortage then all you're doing by giving buyers access to more cash is increasing competition amongst buyers and pushing the prices up.

 

The only way to take the heat out of it is increase supply.  Maybe we need some sort of long term government program, like the Snow Mountains Hydro scheme (original, not 2.0) where the government sets up career pathways for tradies, organises stockpiles of building materials, works with states to release land and builds entire estates to be released equitably at fixed costs (maybe co-owned).

[nomadpete]

1. Even though Spenaroo's folks have 5 residential properties as old age financial support, those properties are still available for occupation (rental). They have not contributed to the housing shortage as far as occupancy goes.

 

2. The purchase price reflects the true current value of a property. The short time on the market is an inducation that the house is not over valued in spite of it being expensive. Simple supply and demand. Capitalism at work.

 

3. The shortage of sellable houses is a reflection of population growth exceeding house building capacity. Our population growth by 'natural reproduction' is almost nil. Therefore the housing shortage is substantially due to migration, and possibly also foreign investors sitting on unoccupied residential property.

 

4. It is unrealistic to compare affordability with past history. Because a 'starter home' when I was young, was a simple, compact, 2 bedroom, cottage with no extras. No garage, no driveway or landscaping. The lifestyle of the buyer in 1955 would nowadays be called 'frugal'. No budget allowance for car, or internet, or phone, or takeaway food. And probably located in an outer suburb that had gravel roads, no street lighting, no nearby shopping malls or hospital. All the things that are taken for granted now.

 

I do not see any entry level homes like this today. Of course current new homes will cost twice (in real terms) what they did when I was young - because they offer twice the lifestyle.

[facthunter]

There's a LOT more House and facilities in the new areas than there used to be. and people want all the latest white goods and modern furniture as well. Ready credit means you can have it all even when it's way beyond your means and you COULD lose a lot of money. if it doesn't work out for you.  Nev

[onetrack]

Australia has imported 8.15M immigrants since the year 2000. There's the major part of the housing problem - letting in more people than we have housing for them.

 

Most boomers would be paying cash for properties because they've just sold their home or their investment property. I don't know that the "cash payment from overseas buyer" is a major problem, but I would expect it is a problem that needs examination. The black market from drugs, bribery, corruption, OMCG's, and general criminality could be up to $100B annually.

 

There are moves to beef up AUSTRAC reporting requirements, to include real estate agents and accountants having to report cash transactions over $10,000. Our current "dirty money" laws are weak, and moves to strengthen them have always been stalled by the LNP.

 

https://www.afr.com/politics/federal/money-laundering-rules-could-be-expanded-to-property-tax-and-law-20230420-p5d1zf

[Marty_d]

1 hour ago, nomadpete said:

 

 

4. It is unrealistic to compare affordability with past history. Because a 'starter home' when I was young, was a simple, compact, 2 bedroom, cottage with no extras. No garage, no driveway or landscaping. The lifestyle of the buyer in 1955 would nowadays be called 'frugal'. No budget allowance for car, or internet, or phone, or takeaway food. And probably located in an outer suburb that had gravel roads, no street lighting, no nearby shopping malls or hospital. All the things that are taken for granted now.

 

I do not see any entry level homes like this today. Of course current new homes will cost twice (in real terms) what they did when I was young - because they offer twice the lifestyle.

Yes and no.

 

The big increase is land cost.  Therefore it doesn't matter if your starter home costs $200,000 or $400,000 to build, if your block costs $1m then the difference is pocket change.

 

Even in the early 90's you could buy blocks of land in Sandy Bay (one of Hobarts priciest suburbs) for $10k.  Good luck getting a block there for less than $800k now.

[spenaroo]

The reality is we have been through several generations of real estate flippers.

those old homes that had land were demolished and subdivided (the block I am on had this - but they left the original house)

those that didn't had updated kitchens and bathrooms thrown in - maybe a wall knocked out. and painted to sell at a premium price.

 

the only ones left untouched are ex-housing commission or rentals that have been left to ruin with landlords not spending a cent in 20 years to maintain the property. (mine was the later - in the same suburb as the former)

 

once again the venn diagram of a first home buyer, and a investor is a circle
 

you see it all the time in the language used in the advertisement - rarely is home buyer mentioned first.
most of the blurb is dedicated to returns and tenancy rates etc....
 

Edited March 13 by spenaroo

[facthunter]

People who move a bit don't want to own a house. Changing over costs too much.  Nev

[Marty_d]

It's gone crazy though.

 

Place down the road from me sold about 9 months ago for 1.4m.

New owners just sold it for 1.9m

 

Close to $500k (minus those expenses) in less than a year for flipping a house.  Nothing at all done to it.

[facthunter]

Yes it can't just go on forever but there has to be more to the Australian dream of owning your own house. You are often not much more than one foot away from the next house and can hear everything. Not for ME if I can help it.  Nev

[facthunter]

And You are  tied down to paying the Bl@@dy thing off forever. There HAS to be more to life than THAT!  Nev

[spacesailor]

Even when you buy an Older house , with it's big backyard . Those peskry neighbours will rebuild ,over 

Your fence line . 

Ask ' Guy Sebastian's ' neighbour .

spacesailor

[nomadpete]

25 minutes ago, facthunter said:

And You are  tied down to paying the Bl@@dy thing off forever. There HAS to be more to life than THAT!  Nev

That hasn't changed, Nev.

My parents had a 30 year mortgage and so did I. Both were finally paid out a couple of years early thanks to an inheritance windfall.

 

And we were often only a couple of months ahead of payments especially when interest rates hit 18%. So I refute the allegations that we all had it easy. Yes, in the end I got a nice capital gain. But it took a lot of doing without along the way.

[Marty_d]

It's the age old buy-vs-rent debate.  Yes, if you don't plan to live in one spot for years on end then you may be better renting (or living on a boat, or out of a campervan, or a tiny home, or whatever takes your fancy).

 

But if you do stay put for years, then you can either pay rent to a landlord or repayments off a mortgage, and in only one of those cases do you end up with an asset to show for it, not to mention being able to alter it however you want and not having the worry of being evicted one day.

 

What I don't like in the housing market is speculative investors who do just buy for the capital gains, in some cases even leaving properties vacant for years.  That doesn't do anything for the housing shortage.  Airbnb etc is another problem (and yes I'm guilty of staying in them, and will again) because if your house is in a holiday area you get far more money from short stay accommodation, even with cleaning/maintenance, than you do from long term renters.

 

 

[Mr.Vegemite]

2 hours ago, onetrack said:

Australia has imported 8.15M immigrants since the year 2000. There's the major part of the housing problem - letting in more people than we have housing for them.

..........

Actually, to turn that around, it is more accurate to say governments and councils didn't plan for that growth and got caught out. The same can be said for all infrastructure like public transport and roads. We needed those immigrants, especially the skilled ones.