The climate change debate continues.

[nomadpete]

The big problem that I see is lack of timely pumped storage.

 

Queensland put in 600MW of pumped storage way back when the state gov't owned all generators.

 

But since then none of subsequent governments want to spend on big social essential infrastructure. There has not been any more such projects. Hence we have a nationwide lack of energy storage. Rising prices are mostly a result of lack of proper planning and commitment by governments. Had they planned over the years, there would already be storage in place that would minimise the power generation gas bills.

 

I give up.

 

I am costing up a private solar plus battery. For me, it's an investment. Even if I die (or move) before it pays for itself, the resale value of the house will be higher.

 

Meantime, I am insulating myself from the problem.

 

 

Edited 4 hours ago by nomadpete
I am avoiding a Grammer Police attack.

[Siso]

intermittents are cheap, SA should be closing the gap compared to other states. We are using less gas and we are at 70+% intermittents. Fossil fuels are yesterdays tech, but will need them for a while, ask Germany

 

France exporting 13GW at the moment  https://app.electricitymaps.com/map/zone/FR/live/fifteen_minutes

[Jerry_Atrick]

As @octave mentione, the wholesale prices are down, and a lot of what is being paid is infrastructre. Remeber, SA is what, the third largest state/terriroty  in Australia, and has 1.8m people scattered over it, far less than the other states, and bigger than the NT and ACT.  That requires a decent amount of infrastructure to maintain, which will reduce with a full transition to renewables with batteries. 

 

France exports a lot of its energy to the UK. Why? Because, since before I was involved in the UK electricity industry, way back in 1996, the government was paralysed 2with its energy policy,. Then some bright sparkdaid gas is cheap.. Let's build a bunch of gass fired generation plants with a 15 year life span, and not have to maintain them in that time (largely not maintain, anyway). At the same time, the same bright spark said let's privatise Nuclear Electric (client of the company I worked for) and Scottish Nuclear (not a client of ours) and form British Energy and float it on the stock exchange. 

 

No prizes for guessing what was going to, and did happen to British Energy. It virtuallywent bust because the gas plants could churn out electricity at next to nothing.. At the same time, there were something like 8 operating plantes for British Energy - all due to decommission within the then next 15 - 20 years. 

 

At the time, with renewables technology where it was, nuclear was still the best technology. Some plants of other companies were tconverted to biomass burners, but they have their own problems. And, in reality, they are anly renewable after a 20 year cycle or thereabouts. 

 

However, renewable technology has come leaps and bounds, but the problem in the UK is planning laws are archaic, dreadfully painful and slow. This didn't impact the gas plants as these were built on existing decomiossioned sites. But, if you want to build capacity in a new site, the planning process can take years. Hinkley Point C, the new build at an existing generation site for the now decomissioned Hinkley Point A and B took over 15 months. Greenfield bew build planning permissions can take years.. The Sizewell C plant had been locked up in planning 26 months.. again at an existing plant. 

 

Renewablesin the UK has been deployed - a mix of solar and wind. Plannign takes forever, even for offshore stuff. Coal plants have been decomissioned as have been the expired gas plants. Nothing new has been built, so the UK for many years has been importing from France. However, since renewables have come online, remebering not a single new nuclear or fossil fuel plant has been built in the UK since 2012 (fossil, I think nuclear was 1996). But since renewables have been being installed, on an annualised basis, the UK was a net exporter of Electricity to France in 2022. 

 

This may seem o blip, but there are a lot of factors in electricity demand. And the UK has been reducing its reliance on imports over the last 5 or so years, since the UK has been bringing online more and more renewable generation capacity. 

[octave]

4 minutes ago, Siso said:

Fossil fuels are yesterdays tech, but will need them for a while,

I have no problem with that statement.

 

A key issue with power prices is that the savings from cleaner technologies often follow upfront investment. My rooftop solar looked expensive at first, but once the installation cost was paid off, my electricity became extremely cheap. The same applies to buying a more efficient car.

No matter how we generate power, Australia needs to build a modern grid. That cost doesn’t disappear if we choose coal.

It’s also worth noting that existing coal stations were built by governments — effectively, taxpayers. If we wanted new or upgraded coal plants today, the bill would again fall on taxpayers or consumers through higher tariffs.

Meanwhile, real-world data shows the transition is already lowering costs. AEMO’s Q3 2025 report shows wholesale prices in South Australia have fallen, with renewables, storage and interconnectors putting clear downward pressure on prices.

So the argument is simple: upfront investment can look costly, but over time it delivers cheaper, cleaner and more reliable power.

[onetrack]

The miners in the W.A. Outback and remote regions are showing the way.

 

https://reneweconomy.com.au/off-grid-gold-miner-achieves-record-renewables-with-101-consecutive-hours-with-engines-off/

[octave]

Just now, onetrack said:

The miners in the W.A. Outback and remote regions are showing the way.

 

https://reneweconomy.com.au/off-grid-gold-miner-achieves-record-renewables-with-101-consecutive-hours-with-engines-off/

 

Yes indeed. I have read a lot of articles lately about how the mining industry, in many ways, is leading the way.