The climate change debate continues.

[octave]

 

[pmccarthy]

The coal consumption in China in 2024 reached 4,947,281,929 metric tonnes, which is 4% more than in 2023, when consumption volume was 4,756,959,903 tonnes. It has been growing in this country for already 8 years in a row. According to the EIA (U.S. Energy Information Administration) data, since 1980, the annual consumption volume of coal has increased by 8.03 times. The minimum of China was recorded in 1980, with a value of 615,814,652 tonnes. The maximum coal consumption was in 2024, when it reached 4,947,281,929 tonnes.

[octave]

17 minutes ago, pmccarthy said:

The coal consumption in China in 2024 reached

I always fact check everything anyone writes and I hope people will fact check what I post.   Your figures are correct but with some caveats.  In the following, I have omitted the calculations that validate your figres because as I say, they are correct. I am happy to provide links.

 

What is potentially misleading?

The statistics themselves are not wrong, but they can be misleading if they're presented without context.

1. China is much larger than it was in 1980

Since 1980:

• GDP has grown by roughly 50–60× (in current US dollars).
• Industrial output has exploded.
• Electricity demand has increased enormously.
• Hundreds of millions of people have moved into cities.

An eight-fold increase in coal use is partly a reflection of China's enormous economic expansion.

---

2. Coal is growing, but so are renewables

One of the unusual features of China's energy system is that both statements are true:

• China consumes more coal than ever.
• China is also installing renewable energy faster than the rest of the world combined.

In 2024 alone China added approximately:

• 277 GW of solar
• 79 GW of wind

bringing total new wind and solar additions to 356 GW in a single year. Non-fossil sources accounted for 56% of installed generating capacity, although fossil fuels still produced about 63% of electricity generation because coal plants are used more consistently.

---

3. Coal consumption isn't the same as coal-fired electricity

Coal in China is used for:

• electricity generation
• steel production
• cement
• chemicals
• industrial heat

Someone using these figures to argue that "China is building huge numbers of coal power stations" is oversimplifying. The statistics refer to total coal consumption, not just coal burned for electricity.

---

4. Coal's share of China's energy is slowly falling

Even though the absolute amount of coal keeps increasing, coal is gradually making up a smaller share of China's total energy mix because renewables, nuclear, and natural gas are growing even faster.

---

Overall assessment

I'd rate the statement as:

• ✅ The numerical data are accurate (assuming the EIA dataset is the source).
• ✅ The 4% increase is correct.
• ✅ The eight-fold increase since 1980 is correct.
• ⚠️ It omits important context, namely that China is simultaneously undergoing the world's largest expansion of renewable energy while still increasing coal use to meet rapidly growing electricity and industrial demand.

[facthunter]

Just who is doing better with renewables than CHINA ?The BIG news here is HOW the USA has got it wrong,  and  Smart, Knowledgeable people there KNOW it. but Trump doesn't WANT to know it. Nev

[octave]

By the way, China's emissions have flat-lined for the last 21 months and may actually be falling slightly, although it is a bit early to celebrate.  

 

https://www.carbonbrief.org/analysis-chinas-co2-emissions-have-now-been-flat-or-falling-for-21-months/

[facthunter]

Perhaps we are not in "Normal" Times.. Nev

[Jerry_Atrick]

8 hours ago, nomadpete said:

The words "New Grid" are BS.

Yes,I agree,, It was a contextual comment and I was being a little lazy - on a train with a phone and fat fingers.

[Jerry_Atrick]

Our discussion around climate change has centred on power generation and ICE cars v EVs. 

 

But, it is a muilt-pronged approach required. As the rest of the world clears its heat sink, China is building its up: https://www.livescience.com/planet-earth/plants/trees-in-chinas-great-green-wall-appear-to-grow-faster-than-natural-forests-study-finds

 

Where fossil or nuclear makes sense, it should be used. The reality with today's technology, there are fewer and fewer places it makes sense. And should the political shift to drive a shift to local storage and distribution, the use of rapidly outdating technologies will make even less sense. 

 

We talk about the economics of doing it, but we rarely talk about the economics of not doing it. And economics is man made, anyway... the real cost (ie. outcomes) of not doing will lead to socio-economic costs far beyond the pure economic cost of doing it. 

 

 

[Marty_d]

1 hour ago, Jerry_Atrick said:

Our discussion around climate change has centred on power generation and ICE cars v EVs. 

 

But, it is a muilt-pronged approach required. As the rest of the world clears its heat sink, China is building its up: https://www.livescience.com/planet-earth/plants/trees-in-chinas-great-green-wall-appear-to-grow-faster-than-natural-forests-study-finds

 

Where fossil or nuclear makes sense, it should be used. The reality with today's technology, there are fewer and fewer places it makes sense. And should the political shift to drive a shift to local storage and distribution, the use of rapidly outdating technologies will make even less sense. 

 

We talk about the economics of doing it, but we rarely talk about the economics of not doing it. And economics is man made, anyway... the real cost (ie. outcomes) of not doing will lead to socio-economic costs far beyond the pure economic cost of doing it. 

 

 

That's exactly the point.

Fossil fuel supporters always bring up the cost of transitioning to renewable as a reason not to do it.

Strangely, they never mention the cost of not doing it 

 

[facthunter]

 NEW Coal fired Power stations not only Pollute, they cost too much and are not flexible. Lots of people die Mining coal. My Grandfather was one of them. Black lung cases still occur and dust goes for Kilometres from Open Cut mines. Subsidence from old mines affects a lot of towns in Australia.. Pollution of rivers, like the MacArthur in the NT is of great concern. We NEED mining BUT clean up your game afterwards..Today the concept of BASELINE Power is used to confuse.  Todey, Peak demand often relates to Airconditioner usage in the afternoon in Private residences.  Not Heavy Industry. Nev