octave Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 I am going to be controversial and say I am all in favour of tipping the balance away from the car and toward pedestrians, bike riders, mobility scooters, and wheelchairs. The balance for many years has been towards allowing cars unimpeded right of way. I know many here may not agree but I do think we have sacrificed a lot at the altar of the motor car. The car is still essential but the problem is there has been a vicious cycle of making things better for cars and therefore worse for all other forms of travel this causing more cars and more congestion and the cycle continues. Multi-billion dollar road projects tend to just move the congestion elsewhere. Other countries have done better. Motorists bitch about cycling infrastructure being built because they may lose a lane here or there and yet countries like the Netherlands place a higher priority on pedestrians, bike riders, etc. are also better counties to drive a car in. "In March 2017, bicycles made up 16 percent of all vehicle movements into the city in the morning peak period (between 7 am and 10 am). In March 2008 the figure was nine percent." https://www.melbourne.vic.gov.au/parking-and-transport/cycling/Pages/cycling-data.aspx These figures are 7 years old and the numbers have only increased since then. If as a motorist you have a slightly narrower lane or a road now has 1 less lane, isn't this preferable to all of those cyclists abandoning their bikes and driving their cars and contributing to traffic jams? We lament the fact that our children are too inactive yet our infrastructure is designed to favour the car. I can understand why parents drive their kids to school. In the Netherlands, I believe around 75% of kids ride to school. This seems pretty good and wholesome to me. I know people here probably don't watch video links however, these 2 videos give a good overview of how other countries have different and I would argue better priorities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacesailor Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 Looks great in a very ' congested city ' , later when it Is old it will be like the " Ghettos " of Warsaw, London, NY . Then will we say , " a great place to live " . The first video has a house with a ' double car ' door . For the push bikes I suppose. spacesailor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
octave Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 (edited) 2 minutes ago, spacesailor said: Looks great in a very ' congested city ' , later when it Is old it will be like the " Ghettos " of Warsaw, London, NY . Then will we say , " a great place to live " . The first video has a house with a ' double car ' door . For the push bikes I suppose. spacesailor You seemed to comment within a time that suggests you did not watch the videos. Edited January 9 by octave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacesailor Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 I did ! . Ten seconds , as I have to have no sound, to annoy the wife's. ROMCOM. LoL spacesailor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
octave Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 1 minute ago, spacesailor said: I did ! . Ten seconds , as I have to have no sound, to annoy the wife's. ROMCOM. LoL spacesailor Sure, i understand but perhaps it is a bit early to comment. 🙂 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red750 Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 I watched both videos, and the thing I took away from them was that the roads, particularly those with heavy bike traffic, were as flat and level as a dining table, and in Canada, there were a couple of minor rises. In our area, the streets are up and down like a roller coaster, some so steep you have to change down a gear or two. Not exactly cycling friendly, unless you are training for the Tour de France. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacesailor Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 (edited) In my area it's " potholes " galore. That even take pedestrians down , a personal experience for me . Remember post war Europe , not many ' private cars ' at all . We all cycled to work . Thousands on the one street .jostling for the first into the pub . Then the " highrise flats " millions crammed into the " bedsitter " 'Yuk' only the owner would enjoy that " existence " . spacesailor P S : A lane either side for buses, ñext to the cycle lane . Next to a parking bay . Leaves a skinny road in the middle for cars . And , now we will have to dodge ' trams ' . I can remember bike wheels stuck in tram tracks. Edited January 9 by spacesailor A little more ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
octave Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 (edited) 13 minutes ago, red750 said: I watched both videos, and the thing I took away from them was that the roads, particularly those with heavy bike traffic, were as flat and level as a dining table, and in Canada, there were a couple of minor rises. In our area, the streets are up and down like a roller coaster, some so steep you have to change down a gear or two. Not exactly cycling friendly, unless you are training for the Tour de France. I am 62 with a dodgy heart but my e-bike allows me to ride even in the steepest hills, Terrain is not really a problem these days. Edited January 9 by octave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pmccarthy Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 I am ten years older and more concerned with terroir than terrain. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
octave Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 1 minute ago, pmccarthy said: I am ten years older and more concerned with terroir than terrain. I want both.🙂 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacesailor Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 And !!! I am a ' war baby ' . 82 this year . Will I ever get on ' my ' push-bike, I haven't tried it YET . No bloody helmet. So do I risk a trial ride without a crashhat . Or pay big bilies for something I may never use . That is a dollar question . spacesailor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red750 Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 11 minutes ago, octave said: my e-bike allows me to ride even in the steepest hills I thought we were talking about deadly treadlties. I know what e-bikes are capable of. I followed a door-dash type guy ride up a decent slope for at least half a k at 50 kph. I don't see too many kids riding e-bikes. e-scooters maybe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red750 Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 1 minute ago, spacesailor said: No bloody helmet. What have you got against helmets spacey? Don't you value your head? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
octave Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 3 minutes ago, spacesailor said: No bloody helmet. So do I risk a trial ride without a crashhat . I bought a reasonable lightweight helmet and it is so comfortable that the other day I put it on to go to the shops and then went back to the house and took it off to do something. When I got to the shop I reached up to take it ff only to realize i had forgotten to put it on. 5 minutes ago, spacesailor said: 82 this year . The thing about bike/pedestrian-friendly cities is they are also good for people with limited mobility. Here is a picture from Amsterdam. Note the great facilities for mobility scooters/ Also, they have these 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacesailor Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 It feels like . Putting your head in a gas oven . Or having a ' straitjacket ' on your head , & squashed ears . Don't you realise that the hat only stops the " Grey smear " on the road . If your head stops before the brain . The " greysmear " is contained . In the dead carcass. Deacceleration kills without mess . Like getting hit with a cricket bat . spacesailor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
octave Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 Notice that the Dutch don't wear helmets. that is another advantage of well-planned bike infrastructure/ Modern helmets are very good, they don't cover your ears. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacesailor Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 The Toongabbie bridge has " powerpoles " in the middle of the footpath. Have to risk putting the babies pram , onto the road to go around the pole . my ' mobility scooter ' can't do that. spacesailor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
octave Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 Just now, spacesailor said: The Toongabbie bridge has " powerpoles " in the middle of the footpath. Have to risk putting the babies pram , onto the road to go around the pole . my ' mobility scooter ' can't do that. spacesailor I certainly understand that and that is my point , we need to do better with our infrastructure 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red750 Posted January 9 Share Posted January 9 Here's a couple that shouldn't cause you too much trouble, spacey. You don't need a full face motorbike type helmet. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacesailor Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 About those ' new ' road lanes , I Did say " get rid of the 'Black ' lane " . But TOO LATE , IT'S NOW A TRAM LANE . Dual of course . So iT's . Parking / cycle / Bus / tram . No IC, or EV, lanes left . spacesailor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry_Atrick Posted January 12 Author Share Posted January 12 (edited) On 09/01/2024 at 10:03 AM, spacesailor said: So do I risk a trial ride without a crashhat . Or pay big bilies for something I may never use . That is a dollar question . How long is the trial ride and where is it going to be ridden? We all do subliminal risk assessments based on our aversion to the nature of the risk versus the reward. Personally, I don't get on any bike without a helmet (and it is not a legal requirement here), except if I am in the back yard.. and even then I will normally put one on as I am so used to them, I feel somewhat naked without one. I can speak from experience, as I can on behalf of others, they are a life, or at least serious injury saver. It can happen to anyone, anywhere. I was riding through Richmond Park in an area far from the cars (that ae camera enforced to 30kph), and the back wheel slipped on some ice and I was in free fall backwards with no way of stopping or even braking the fall. It was surreal and slow, not being able to do anything about it. I hit the pavement squarely with my upper back which caused the back of my head to whip into the hard pavement. No helmet, and I may not be here today; or at least I wold have had possibly some life changing injury - all on the day of Christmas eve. Instead, my helmet (Arduro I think is the rand.. was made in NZ) took the brunt and the surreality amplified as I could literally feel the forces being dissipated around the helmet. When I got up, I noticed my helmet was loose; the force was so strong it snapped the compressed foam around the strap which is why I couldn't fasten the helmet. All for a simple, calm ride in a park on a nice day with no cars and what should have been very little risk. And not even a headache, to boot. I know others who have suffered similar spills, and the ones without helmets are still not in a good way. I don't let my kids (who are both now adults) ride without one. You make your choices, accept the risk, and wear the consequences should it go pear shaped.. Edited January 12 by Jerry_Atrick 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacesailor Posted January 13 Share Posted January 13 About those ' new ' road lanes , I Did say " get rid of the 'Black ' lane " . But TOO LATE , IT'S NOW A TRAM LANE . Dual of course . So iT's . Parking / cycle / Bus / tram . No IC, or EV, lanes left . spacesailor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
octave Posted January 13 Share Posted January 13 3 minutes ago, spacesailor said: About those ' new ' road lanes , I Did say " get rid of the 'Black ' lane " . But TOO LATE , IT'S NOW A TRAM LANE . Dual of course . So iT's . Parking / cycle / Bus / tram . No IC, or EV, lanes left . Some more information might make this post more relevant. Which road are you referring to? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacesailor Posted January 13 Share Posted January 13 Your right , of course ! . So my push bikes will go out for garbage pick up. No sense in risking another fall . I haven't got over my last one . spacesailor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacesailor Posted January 13 Share Posted January 13 Lots of new ' tramway ' roads now closed to motor vehicles. In the heart of Parramatta. Locals thought they had a reprieve, after it all stopped, but alas it's still going ahead . spacesailor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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