Electric car thread

[Marty_d]

I didn't watch it, but read the fact checking of it.

What an example of terrible journalism.

Unsurprising though given the presenter previously worked for Shell.

[Siso]

Hmmm the ABC!

[octave]

5 minutes ago, Siso said:

Hmmm the ABC!

The mistruths are easily provable.  I am happy to go through them one by one.

[kgwilson]

The Nickel mining story was aired 6 months ago. Almost all of the nickel is for the stainless steel industry, not EVs. The presenters fossil fuel bias and links have been well established. Channel 7 had to close comments within a couple of days as almost all were highly critical of the claims made. NMC batteries for EVs are now in the minority but even so 98% of all minerals including lithium, cobalt and nickel are recovered in battery recycling so are not wasted and reduce the need for expanded mining.

 

LFP is now the dominant technology for EV batteries but sodium batteries are becoming available and making major inroads in to the battery storage industry. They are also between 30% & 60% cheaper given the abundance of sodium & ease of extraction. Start with evaporating sea water to get NaCl, common salt, separate the 2 elements and you have sodium and chloride. 

[facthunter]

Cl  ( the element) is Chlorine, Sodium and Chlorine are both highly reactive and nasty substances to life forms.  Nev

[pmccarthy]

"The presenters fossil fuel bias and links have been well established." Why do we keep seeing such attacks on sources rather than on the information? In my opinion, many if not most journalists have an anti-fossil fuel and nuclear bias that is obvious to see and affects everything they write. But there is no point in saying so every time a source is quoted. 

[facthunter]

Why trust a KNOWN and proven to be, Biased source? Surely FACTS are what we need. Not propaganda by Vested interests.  Somewhere between the arguments lies the truth? Not necessarily. Confusion is also Practiced by devious sources.  IF you Post or link stuff here Be Prepared to OWN it  if you don't state otherwise.  Isn't THAT reasonable? AI is going to Make this task more difficult in the futeur anyhow.. Nev

[octave]

1 hour ago, pmccarthy said:

"The presenters fossil fuel bias and links have been well established." Why do we keep seeing such attacks on sources rather than on the information?

PM, the media watch segment does note the journalist's history; however, its main thrust is about mistruths.  The journo says "it (cobalt) has been the key element in practically every storage battery on the planet" Whilst cobalt was a common ingredient, this is no longer the case. This should have been pointed out, but that would detract from the purpose of the story.

 

If the problem is cobalt, then why limit criticism to its (diminishing) use in EVs and renewables?  My understanding is that about a third of all cobalt is used in laptops and smartphones as well as jet engines, medical implants, car tyres and pigments. But this would not fit the narrative.

 

Whilst the vast majority of EVs and storage batteries are now LFP those other uses still remain, but this seems to be OK. 

 

I am intending to buy an EV within the next year and I am only considering LFP (which is pretty much the vast majority), so there is no story here.  Awareness of the problems with cobalt is fairly recent, so I certainly would not point at someone in their EV or hybrid (Corolla Cross?) and yell, "blood battery".       I am also keenly aware that cobalt is used in my phone, PC, etc.

 

 

 

[Marty_d]

1 hour ago, pmccarthy said:

"The presenters fossil fuel bias and links have been well established." Why do we keep seeing such attacks on sources rather than on the information? In my opinion, many if not most journalists have an anti-fossil fuel and nuclear bias that is obvious to see and affects everything they write. But there is no point in saying so every time a source is quoted. 

Feel free to point out when a journalist actually has worked for a solar panel or wind turbine manufacturer for 2 years.

[old man emu]

Cobalt is an essential trace mineral for ruminants (cattle, sheep, goats) used by rumen microorganisms to synthesize vitamin B12 (cobalamin). It is critical for energy production, glucose synthesis, protein metabolism, and growth. Deficiencies cause severe loss of appetite, anemia, "wasting disease," and poor productivity, with young, rapidly growing animals and sheep being most susceptible.

 

https://csiropedia.csiro.au/cobalt-deficiency-and-the-cure-for-coast-disease/

[facthunter]

Most of the PEOPLE who Pay Journalists and control what they say are Pro Coal and Oil Nuclear and wars. and "despise" Unions who represent workers and strive to Improve their conditions. The Farmers Have their Federation. The franchise Chemist Warehouse has Plenty of clout, Too Much??  . Wars make money and sell Papers.  The little Man can keep quiet and think himself lucky  to not starve. Slaves  were the Foundation of America's system, don't forget . How ironic that the downtrodden still don't Matter..  Nev

[facthunter]

 One trace element of Many for Plants and Animals (People).  Iodine is lacking in Most soils and zinc supplements are often added to other sprays that go On Leaves (Foliar) . Another one is selenium and copper. Some of these are "Essential" trace elements. Nothing to do with Vitamins, which are another story. Nev