Climbing Uluru

[Bruce]

In hate to say it methusala, but feudalism might be the future. Capitalism is too voracious of the earth's resources and cares nothing for the long-term future. Mind you, in the olden days when people with real grievances might want to assassinate a feudal ruler, they lacked sniper rifles.

 

 

[old man emu]

One Law for the Whites, another for the Natives.

 

From https://www.londontoolkit.com/whattodo/stonehenge_special_access.htm

 

When you visit Stonehenge during public hours you have to keep behind a small rope fence about two foot off the ground. For most people this is perfectly adequate and has the advantage that no people get into your photographs. For those who are really, really interested in Stonehenge it is possible to go beyond the rope fence and walk among the stones. These visits are called Special Access or Inner Circle visits and take place outside public opening hours (i.e. dawn or dusk). With the exception of special days such as the two solstices and equinoxes, where special provision is made at dawn, this is the only time you will be able to walk amongst the stones at Stonehenge.

 

One of the most famous landmarks in the United Kingdom, Stonehenge is regarded as a British cultural icon. It has been a legally protected Scheduled Ancient Monument since 1882 when legislation to protect historic monuments was first successfully introduced in Britain. The site and its surroundings were added to UNESCO's list of World Heritage Sites in 1986.

 

 

[facthunter]

At the moment, the growing disparity between the very rich and the  poor is causing uprisings in almost everywhere .If this is just ignored  and/or forcibly suppressed, we can expect  unending strife and uncertainty. Capitalism as often practiced, leads to  MONOPOLISTIC megastructures without competition and short term profit  capital investment and often corrupt processes of approval  and environmentally disasterous outcomes, where the damage is left for others to deal with and not considered a part of the cost of production as it should, and must be. Nev

 

 

[willedoo]

Willedoo, that is news to me about pastoral leases and native title coexisting. 

 

Bruce, I'm not sure about other States, but it does here. When they're granted Native Title, it gives them access rights to properties within that title boundary for traditional purposes. I don't know if it gives them any veto rights over mining activities. They're usually obliged to notify the pastoralist of visits and respect the usual rules with livestock, water and closing gates etc.. Native title is extinguished by freehold title, so it's only leasehold land affected. Native title doesn't give them much at all really. Mining exploration companies have more rights and can come on freehold land if they have the permits.

 

The other situation is where the government has compensated the pastoral lease holder for resumption of the lease and granted it to the traditional owners in perpetuity under a title of unalienable freehold. In that case, the Aboriginals own the land entirely. It's common to confuse that with Native Title rights. Again, I don't know the situation with miners rights on freehold Aboriginal land.

 

 

[Bruce]

Thanks Willedoo. From my knowledge in South Australia, freehold title does NOT confer any rights over mining companies. But last year, some liberal country backbenchers defied the premier and delighted their constituents by threatening to cross the floor over mining exploration access without permission to freehold farming land. I need to research this some more.

 

 

[willedoo]

Thanks Willedoo. From my knowledge in South Australia, freehold title does NOT confer any rights over mining companies. But last year, some liberal country backbenchers defied the premier and delighted their constituents by threatening to cross the floor over mining exploration access without permission to freehold farming land. I need to research this some more.

 

I'm a bit rusty on the legal side of it. In S.A., a PEL, petroleum exploration lease, covers oil & gas, in Qld., an authority to prospect (ATP) does the same. Not sure whether they cover minerals or whether that's a different permit. Where I live, most of the area is under exploration leases, but you never see any real exploration done. The issue gets a bit contentious when it comes to exploration on freehold farms.

 

 

[red750]

Discussion in this thread about aborigines not working. It's the white Australians who won't work. 

 

Try ringing a call centre - all you get is foreign accents you can't understand, and who can't understand you. They work to a script, and if you don't answer in accordance with what the script expects, tough luck.

 

The same goes for technicians. Getting an Aussie tech to your house is damned near impossible. We are becoming as dispossessed as aborigines. Of course, the Equal Opportunity do-gooders won't allow an employer to stipulate Australian applicants only.

 

Ask a farmer looking for fruit pickers - all backpackers on working visas. Couldn't get an Aussie to do that! They're all too busy blockading the streets protesting about something they rely on (see gripes thread). 

 

This country is an ass.

 

 

[bexrbetter]

At the moment, the growing disparity between the very rich and the  poor is causing uprisings in almost everywhere .

 

 

 

And yet "Poor" people have it better than they ever had, EVER, in history.

 

Google the late 1800s and the wealthy people who would dress up as poor people in London to visit the horrific conditions suffered. It was actually those trips, sometimes organised tours, that made humanitarians step up to help the (deperately) poor, leading to the societies we have today with water, sewerage, hospitals, police, electricity etc.

 

I laugh when I see on the Internet someone screaming "Capitalism!" - while taking complete advantage of all the Socialism items mentioned there, and more, and the internet acess itself.

 

What happens when you give ignorant people a little, they want more and mostly expect others to do it for them, and give it to them for nothing.

 

 

[bexrbetter]

Meanwhile ...

 

[ATTACH]50421._xfImport[/ATTACH]

[facthunter]

So you are happy to go into the average OLD People's Home, as they are now, are you. Bex?  Nev.

 

 

[Bruce]

I reckon the current situation with old folks homes is a great example of people wanting more from governments than they are prepared to pay for.

 

They want to dump their oldies yet have them taken good care of without cost to themselves and their inheritance.

 

It would be easy to fix: increase the charges for those who don't want to do voluntary work. This would take more backbone than is available I fear.

 

 

[octave]

I reckon the current situation with old folks homes is a great example of people wanting more from governments than they are prepared to pay for.

 

They want to dump their oldies yet have them taken good care of without cost to themselves and their inheritance.

 

It would be easy to fix: increase the charges for those who don't want to do voluntary work. This would take more backbone than is available I fear.

 

 

 

Bruce we have just navigated this system. My we put my father into an aged care facility because my mother could no longer look after him.  When you suggest that people "dump their oldies yet have them taken good care of without cost to themselves and their inheritance."  I wonder if you are aware of the costs?  If someone were to be trying to preserve their inheritance they would try to keep their loved one at home.   Even basic aged care takes pretty much all of my fathers pension and their savings will be eventually eaten into down to I think $49500 each.  Their house is protected until my mother inevitably goes in when the house will become an assessable asset.

 

It is a complicated system too get your head around but basically since 2014 people have been required to substantially contribute to their aged care.

 

 

[facthunter]

Check whether the OWNER has a big Yacht . Managing "fleecing " oldies is big business and the treatment of them is often outrageous. There are some good (better) ones but look hard. I'd rather DIE than go into any I know of.  Nev

 

 

[octave]

We are quite happy with the place my father went into.  Of course he would rather be at home but this is not possible.  Since he went in life has improved for them. My mother visits every day and can stay overnight if she wishes.   He is treated very well but it does help that he does not have any dementia and other than some medical needs is affable and liked by the staff.   If I was to criticize anything it would be the low staff ratios on weekends. Well meaning staff with too much work.   My father's only complaint is that although they serve a glass of wine three days a week he is not impressed with the quality.  We are putting a bar fridge in his room which we will ensure is stocked with his favourite NZ sav blanc.

 

Less frail residents come and go from the facility as they please.

 

Nev like you I have no wish to end my days in such a place however in my father's case his life has improved. Earlier this year we visited (we live in a different state) and in the middle of the night we could hear my mother trying to take care of him and him crying an saying "I don't know what you want me to do" pretty sad to hear.    After weeks of this my mother pretty much lost it and gave up. Now he is reasonably happy and they spend the day together watching TV or reading or he will surf the net on his beloved Ipad (not bad for 91).    In this case aged care was literally a life saver.

 

To inject a few facts into the discussion the cost everyone pays in aged care is $51.63 per day which is the basic daily fee, this equates to 85% of the aged pension.  There is a second fee which is the care fee which is means tested and is between $0 and $252 a day, In my fathers case he pays $10 a day  Any extra costs are on a fee for service basis for extras. My father pays a few dollars a week for wine.

 

There is a lifetime cap  on the care fee of $27754 per year or $66610.  

 

You can pay for the accommodation fee (fully or partially) by paying a RAD which is around $300000 more or less but depends on the particular place. This is refunded in full when you "leave" to you or your estate   What happens here is that the interest from your RAD pays for some or all of the accommodation fee.   

 

 

[bexrbetter]

So you are happy to go into the average OLD People's Home, as they are now, are you. Bex?  Nev.

 

I have no idea what that means.

 

 

[Bruce]

Good onyer Octave. There should be more like you looking after their oldies in those places.

 

My mother went into a government one after suffering a stroke which left her a vegetable. The only thing she could do was continually pull out any tubes until they stopped putting them in her. I think she wanted to die but they wouldn't let her of course.

 

 

[Bruce]

Bex, what is the situation in China for old folks?

 

 

[Bruce Tuncks]

Once I asked of a smart old aborigine did he reckon they were better off since white folk arrived, and he said they sure were.

I was reminded of this when that woman said about captain cook and invasion day. Just imagine what would happen to the aborigines if white folk and all their products were to vanish. Naked aborigines would have to try and feed themselves off the land again, armed only with sticks. They were few and skinny last time they had to do this.

No wonder they consider themselves better off now.

Sometimes I ask the dog if he would like to be a wild dog and go without until the pack did a successful hunt. He shows no sign of wanting this.

Edited May 12, 2020 by Guest

[Bruce Tuncks]

Once as a kid I actually went on a kangaroo hunt with some Yuendumu aborigines. They had a green flat-top truck and 303 rifles, and we drove out to a bore and stock water troughs where the kangaroos came to drink at dusk..

[old man emu]

We are quite happy with the place my father went into.

 

Has he been OK during the C-19 crisis?

[octave]

Has he been OK during the C-19 crisis?

 

 

Relatively OK, for quite a while he was not able to have visitors but can now have limited visits. We have been having zoom meetings. He is very near the end of his life at 92 with very poor lung function so deinately would not cope well with covid. To get to 92 is quite an achievement although I do hope I don't ast quite that long. Thanks far asking

[old man emu]

92?! He's just a pup. Make sure that the staff where he lives do not have any Filipinos or Indians amongst them. I know it is a "racist" thing to say, but these people don't deem to be able to grasp the enormity of the effect they can have if they bring an illness into a closed community like an aged care facility. I've seen how these staff treat not only residents, but other employees and contractors. The only decent aged care facilities I'v dealt with have been staffed by Europeans.

 

Managing "fleecing " oldies is big business and the treatment of them is often outrageous.

 

He's not wrong on both counts.