Corruption in Ukraine

[Bruce Tuncks]

I was shocked on reading about corruption still existing in Ukraine. Previously, I thought that while it used to be corrupt, since Zelenskyy things have improved dramatically.

Alas I now have my doubts.

One of the worst things was reading that "most people" expected to have to bribe the police... gosh I hope that this was years ago and not now.

[willedoo]

It would be hard to get rid of it completely, but they've made good inroads into it. This week the European Commission gave the go-ahead to start negotiations on Ukraine joining the EU. They said that Ukraine has complied with 90% of the EU requirements for membership. A lot of the requirements are involved with political and government reform, and the cleaning up of corruption. Not a bad effort when compared to Turkey who applied for EU membership in 1987 and are still not accepted thirty six years later .

[Bruce Tuncks]

I always thought that Turkey was a backwards Islamic place. Is it corrupt too?

And yes, you are right willedoo, the EU must have more up-to date stuff than I can get my hands on.

[willedoo]

I'm not very familiar with Turkey's application but I would make a guess that EU human rights standards would be an issue there.

[willedoo]

Possibly due to their treatment of the Kurds.

[Bruce Tuncks]

Yep, I notice that "treatment of minorities" was a condition of joining the EU. Turkey would fail for sure with the treatment of its Kurds.

[old man emu]

We really live in a unique country when it comes to the expectation of officials for something to "help the process along".

 

A bloke once offered me $20.00 to go no further with a speeding ticket. He eventually was convicted of "Offer Bribe" and was fined. He also lost his $20.00 which was forfeited to the Crown. And he still got done for speeding.

[facthunter]

There was more crime in the UK during the war than normal and I expect that to be  normal in war.  Nev

[Jerry_Atrick]

4 hours ago, willedoo said:

I'm not very familiar with Turkey's application but I would make a guess that EU human rights standards would be an issue there.

Erdogan certainly won't help Turkey's cause; he purged the judiciary within months of his first term.

 

But, Turkey coudl transform all it wants; Greece will always veto it..

[nomadpete]

9 minutes ago, Jerry_Atrick said:

Turkey coudl transform all it wants; Greece will always veto it..

I heard somewhere that Greece held the title of world's leading corrupt country?

[Jerry_Atrick]

I haven't heard that, but undoubtedly, it was up there.

[nomadpete]

To put it into context, I recall it was with reference to tourism at the time. So probably only referring to daily bribes affecting tourism, not necessarily the big end of town.

 

In fact the writer mentioned the need to hire "financial guide" there and some Red Sea countries. This helps the traveller to spend on productive bribes rather than con men bribes. Even the bribing system is riddled with its own corruption.

 

Of course the writer cautioned visitors to carefully research to find an honest bribe guide!

 

 

 

Edited November 10, 2023 by nomadpete

[Bruce Tuncks]

Interesting huh that an independent judiciary is very important for avoiding corruption. And here's me complaining how they are too easy-going ...

 

[Bruce Tuncks]

I guess it's much easier to get into the EU than to get chucked out. How come Greece is still in there if they are so corrupt?

[facthunter]

They get financed by Russia other wise. This was before all this Ukraine stuff started. Greeks don't want to pay  any TAX..  Nev

[onetrack]

The Tax system in Greece is amazing. It's like paying tax is optional there. The Tax inspectors come around to collect tax, and it becomes a "negotiated settlement", like an Asian market purchase, rather than any amount set by rules and regulations.

[willedoo]

2 hours ago, Bruce Tuncks said:

I guess it's much easier to get into the EU than to get chucked out. How come Greece is still in there if they are so corrupt?

To evict a member would need the unanimous vote of all 27 member countries. You would have to be pretty bad to have them all vote against you. Same in reverse, you need the vote of all members to join. That's why Ukraine will never be able to join the EU while putin's butt plug Viktor Orban, PM of Hungary, is still in power and can veto. putin also now has a second mole in the EU with the pro Russia mob winning power in Slovakia.

[Bruce Tuncks]

Hungary is a tragic place...  I well remember the uprising ( 1954 I think) when the army supported the protesters and the russians came in brutally killing thousands.

This led eventually to Aborigines being citizens, since the russians were ready and primed when Australia joined the chorus of complaints about their wicked ways. The worst-off ethnic group in the Soviet Union  had better stats than the abos had in those days. Australians were on the nose for months after the russians pointed all this out.

In my first job as an engineer, I worked with a Hungarian woman who said that their whole history was messed up with traitors of various types. I hope that she ( Viola) finished up alright. The other guy there was Frank the pole, who saved to go back to Poland where they couldn't understand his language. Frank was a smart draughtsman but hopeless as a linguist. We couldn't understand him either, he spoke such a heavily accented mixture of polish and english so as to be incomprehensible. ( he had left Poland in 1939 to work as a mechanic on spitfires)

[willedoo]

This is an example of Russia's imperial aspirations:

 

photo #1.  - how you join the EU.

photo #2. - how you join Russia.