Phil Perry Posted August 30, 2017 Share Posted August 30, 2017 The Voyager 1 space probe will be forty years old in a few days. [ATTACH]48924._xfImport[/ATTACH] Voyager is the most distant man made object that our species has created. . .. Since the beginning of it's mission on September 5th, 1977, Voyager has now travelled over 20,775,000,000 kilometers from Earth. Voyager continues on to the wide expanse of our universe. Destined to find something out there ? A new planet to orbit, a black hole to enter ? Perhaps even reaching the the edge of the universe. . . .(If indeed the Universe HAS an 'Edge' ) [ATTACH]48925._xfImport[/ATTACH] What is known is that Voyager will long outlive us, indeed, our species and the planet that we call home. Long after the Earth is consumed by the (red Giant) sun in around 7.6 billion years. [ATTACH]48926._xfImport[/ATTACH] We may never know if any alien lifeform will encounter it and perhaps play the 12 inch gold disc impregnated with Uranium 238, so that any spacefaring intelligent life could deduce it's age, using the steady degradation rate of the Uranium isotope . .( ratio between depleted and remaining ) and play some of the music, and the sights and sounds of Earth. . .Along with astronavigational information as to our wherebouts. . . . [ATTACH]48927._xfImport[/ATTACH] The last picture of Earth ( the tiny blue dot on the right ) as reported by Voyager. . . So in just a few days from now,. . . Happy Birthday Voyager 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Koreelah Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 Great post Phil. Besides the bicycle, the two Voyagers would have to be the greatest machines mankind has ever created. Your mobile phone has a gazillion times the computer power of a Voyager spacecraft. I believe they use reel to reel tape and have 4kilobyte (no, not 4megabytes or four gigabytes, just 4k) of memory. They're so well-built that they've far outlasted their original mission. It was never anticipated that they'd still be going strong after Jupiter, which is what their sensors were designed for. They had to be re-programmed to make time exposures of the much dimmer outer planets and their moons as they sped by. They've transformed our understanding of the solar system with the enormous knowledge they've sent home. I'd nominate the whole Voyager team for a Nobel Prize in Science. They showed what America can do at its best. I even have to admit that without its Nuclear power supply, none of this would have been possible. Last year I ordered a commemorative Voyager Gold Record and assorted stuff. It is due to arrive next week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Perry Posted August 31, 2017 Author Share Posted August 31, 2017 I know what you mean with regard to the quantum leap in technology over the past four decades, Jeeze, my mobile phone is so bloody complicated that I can only figure out less than half of what it can do . . . It is interesting also to note that the probe planners used seven known 'Pulsars' to pinpoint the location of Earth in the Milky Way galaxy . . .these things are extremely bright 'flashing' beacons in the firmament. A very clever bit of info to include on the spacecraft . . .should anyone ( clever sentient being ) ever find it plodding through space. . . I was surprised to learn also that the transmitter power output of the antenna dish was 20 watts of RF energy. . . this means that, considering the Inverse Square Law affecting transmitted radio signals, ie that the strength of the signal deteriorates as the inverse square of the distance traveled, that the receivers on Earth would have to detect a VERY tiny signal to the power of minus 21 . . from old science lessons at school, I think this negative exponential was termed Zeph watts or something like that ( Milli - micro - nano - pico . . .etc. ) Basically rather like trying to hear a sparrow farting on the opposite side of the world. . . fascinating. . . Wow ! I didn't know that Voyager memorabilia was available OK, I wonder it you could save me five minutes of googling time with some sort of link ? ( ! ! ! ) I have a young relative who is studying physics at uni, and is a complete astronomy freak and I could suggest that to his folks as a darned good birthday gift. I also fervently hope that you have opted to order the gold disc copy Without the U238 coating,. . . ( ! ) Musing again WRT to the on board nuclear power source on the probe,. . I wonder if anyone thought to put a couple of bright yellow 'Danger - Radiation' stickers on it ? ? Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old man emu Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 Where is it now? Voyager - Mission Status It has left our solar system and is in interstellar space. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Perry Posted August 31, 2017 Author Share Posted August 31, 2017 Where is it now? Voyager - Mission Status It has left our solar system and is in interstellar space. It will be interesting to discover whether the probe manages to pass through the Oort cloud . . . though it might be too far away from Earth by then for us to detect any telemetry from it. . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Koreelah Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 Where is it now? Voyager - Mission Status It has left our solar system and is in interstellar space. Thanks for that link, OME. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Koreelah Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 ...Wow ! I didn't know that Voyager memorabilia was available OK, I wonder it you could save me five minutes of googling time with some sort of link... Phil this might help, but I believe it's limited edition so you might have to rob a train or commit a capital crime to get one. New Kickstarter Wants To Reissue NASA's Golden Record Ozma Records Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Perry Posted August 31, 2017 Author Share Posted August 31, 2017 Phil this might help, but I believe it's limited edition so you might have to rob a train or commit a capital crime to get one.New Kickstarter Wants To Reissue NASA's Golden Record Ozma Records Thanks for that OK. I've passed the link on to the 'Man' he's well wedged, so he may be able to bribe them ! By the way, I noticed an error in my original posting, I said that contained in the probe, there were Astronavigational details denoting the spatial position of Earth, using seven Pulsars . . .I checked my notes and it's actually fourteen of these, and also a basic diametric measurement of time. A drawing of the hydrogen atom in its two lowest states, with a connecting line and digit to indicate that the time interval associated with the transition from one state to the other is to be used as the fundamental time scale. The 'Human' graphics are represented alongside a drawing of the spacecraft's dish antenna to show the scale comparison between the physical machine thereby denoting the size and general appearance of the average human being. . . [ATTACH]48931._xfImport[/ATTACH] Another one of the 19,000 images sent back by Voyager 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Perry Posted August 31, 2017 Author Share Posted August 31, 2017 Where is it now? Voyager - Mission Status It has left our solar system and is in interstellar space. Thanks for the link Sir. . . . I'll have to get my retired maths teacher friend working on a calculation based upon the quoted spatial velocity of the probe, ( bit over 38,000 mph ) against the rough diameter of the milky way Galaxy,. . . where we are in the spiral arm, and therefore whether the probe will exit the edge of the Galaxy on it's current angular trajectory,. . ( Bearing mind that Voyager 2 was diverted 'Upwards' (? out of the 'Plane' of the solar system in order to do a flyby of some planet, can't recall which one, which would cause it to leave the MW galaxy earlier, as the edge would be way closer than if it proceeded in a similar plane to V1.) Before the Sun becomes a red Giant and swallows the inner planets. . .( 7.6 Billion years approx ) The above also depends upon what trajectory, relative to the angular plane of the solar system that the probe departed upon after it's slingshotting missions were accomplished following the successful flyby of Triton, a moon of Neptune, the final picture taking session. . . it was around this position that the single pixel photo of 'Home' was taken according to JPL. It aslo depends upon what angular plane the solar system itself sits upon, relative to the rest of the Galaxy . .. That's enough now,. .. my small brain is beginning to hurt. . . .I can't explain what I'm getting at without a whiteboard, or a powerpoint presentation. .( ! ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Koreelah Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 You're not Robinson Crusoe, Phil. My brain starts to hurt when trying to comprehend the distances involved. For decades the Voyagers have been absolutey p1ssing along, yet they've only recently got to the edge of our system. Before I do any long trips, they'll need to perfect the hyperdrive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Perry Posted August 31, 2017 Author Share Posted August 31, 2017 You're not Robinson Crusoe, Phil. My brain starts to hurt when trying to comprehend the distances involved. For decades the Voyagers have been absolutey p1ssing along, yet they've only recently got to the edge of our system. Before I do any long trips, they'll need to perfect the hyperdrive. Indeed OK.. . . . The Hyperdrive,. . . or 'Warp Drive' or string theory drive . . . . will, no doubt be invented, but sadly NOT in my lifetime nor perhaps yours. . .even with the invention of a Nuclear Fusion Power source. . . . the distances are just TOO damned Large for 'Normal' space travel, no matter what the acceleration IN DYNAMIC TERMS can be achieved.. . .It has already been calculated that,. .if a space vessel could travel at the speed of light, (Impossible, accordng to Mr. Einstein's theory,. . . as mass increases exponentially with the increase in velocity. . . .so we need some way of warping space,. . .if we are ever to travaille vast distances in our Galaxy, to attend any Galactic conventions or 'Fly - Ins' in the linear sense. . . . It would be a little pointless, considering Mr. Einstein's theory of Dilation of Time,. . .to visit a weekend fly-in on some Earth like planet near Rigel 3, and then when we got home, the Earth had aged 250 years and all your mates and all your known family were long dead and buried. . .. . . . bit of a silly excercise really.. . . .Maybe the 'Stargate' people have got the answer. . .'Wormholes'. . . . ? ? ? ? Instant travel anywhere in the universe. . . .? ? ? WELL, if the universe is Infinite,. . .then surely there must be ways to traverse it ?. . . .surely God would have thought of this when he built the place so fekking BIG ? ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Koreelah Posted September 1, 2017 Share Posted September 1, 2017 That's enough, Phil. My brain is hurting again. Time for more red. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty_d Posted September 1, 2017 Share Posted September 1, 2017 That's enough, Phil. My brain is hurting again. Time for more red. At 10:45am, OK?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty_d Posted September 1, 2017 Share Posted September 1, 2017 We may not have to go that far. Apparently there's 3 planets in the goldilocks zone around Proxima Centauri, which is the closest star to our solar system. Only 4 light-years away (only!) We could theoretically send a very small unmanned craft - perhaps with a huge sail, powered by lasers fired from Earth - that could get to a significant percentage of c, maybe even 10% - so it'd make the trip in 40 years plus acceleration. Of course it wouldn't be able to slow down when it got there, but it could send back a heap of data, which at light speed would take 4 years to return to Earth. Of course there's relativity thrown in there too... so it'd be 40+ years for the spacecraft but more for us... any physicists out there who can tell us how much more? So no - not in our lifetimes... but maybe in our kids', or their kids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Koreelah Posted September 1, 2017 Share Posted September 1, 2017 At 10:45am, OK?? Daytime or nighttime, it's always the right time.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Perry Posted September 1, 2017 Author Share Posted September 1, 2017 We may not have to go that far. Apparently there's 3 planets in the goldilocks zone around Proxima Centauri, which is the closest star to our solar system. Only 4 light-years away (only!) We could theoretically send a very small unmanned craft - perhaps with a huge sail, powered by lasers fired from Earth - that could get to a significant percentage of c, maybe even 10% - so it'd make the trip in 40 years plus acceleration. Of course it wouldn't be able to slow down when it got there, but it could send back a heap of data, which at light speed would take 4 years to return to Earth. Of course there's relativity thrown in there too... so it'd be 40+ years for the spacecraft but more for us... any physicists out there who can tell us how much more? So no - not in our lifetimes... but maybe in our kids', or their kids. Easy Peasy to slow it down Marty. . .you simply use the nuclear explosion priniciple.. . Pulsed.nuclear blasts, created ahead of a large dish screen to protect the astronauts. . . this would decellerate the craft to orbital velocity and enable normal descent to a planetary body . . . Hmmmmm. . . . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nomadpete Posted September 2, 2017 Share Posted September 2, 2017 Daytime or nighttime, it's always the right time.... That only worked in the age of the Viscount. (The best of them all) Makes me wonder why Viscounts aren't still flying..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rgmwa Posted September 2, 2017 Share Posted September 2, 2017 Easy Peasy to slow it down Marty. . .you simply use the nuclear explosion priniciple.. . Pulsed.nuclear blasts, created ahead of a large dish screen to protect the astronauts. . . this would decellerate the craft to orbital velocity and enable normal descent to a planetary body . . . Hmmmmm. . . . . . That should work. All remaining parts of the spacecraft would land at the same time. rgmwa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted September 2, 2017 Share Posted September 2, 2017 They're not flying because they are crap. Everything goes time ex on them. Wing spars. pressurised skin. We lost 3 of them. Due failures of structure and fire. Nearly lost another due inflight fire and one on training at Mangalore. No fault of the plane, there though, unless what they were doing was an approved technique . There's always a reason for the problem but the planes were lightly built. As they lifted off the top of the wing would go corrugated as it bent upwards the engines would nod down in turbulence with the wing twisting. It was supposed to unload it in an updraft, which it probably did do. Nev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty_d Posted September 2, 2017 Share Posted September 2, 2017 Easy Peasy to slow it down Marty. . .you simply use the nuclear explosion priniciple.. . Pulsed.nuclear blasts, created ahead of a large dish screen to protect the astronauts. . . this would decellerate the craft to orbital velocity and enable normal descent to a planetary body . . . Hmmmmm. . . . . . There was a sci-fi book ("Footfall" perhaps?) where humans did that. In another one by Cixin Liu (only came out recently) - humans accelerate a small craft by launching conventionally, then exploding pre-positioned nuclear warheads (which had been placed earlier by modified ICBM's) behind it as it passes. You'd want to get your timing right on that one. Closer to home, my 7yo son Harry made a rocket today from toilet tubes and paper - complete with boosters, fuel tank and shuttle. He set it up outside and lit the fuse (string) - whereby it burned merrily until ash. To cheer him up I showed the kids the Top Gear episode where they launch a Robin Reliant into the sky... always good for a laugh! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nomadpete Posted September 2, 2017 Share Posted September 2, 2017 OK Nev, you got me there. I wasn't trying to be serious. I was thinking of the irony of the original cigarette advertisement which sang "Daytime or night time, It's always the right time, To light up a Viscount", which was in rather poor taste in view of the firey problems (and loss of life) suffered by some Viscount aircraft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Koreelah Posted September 2, 2017 Share Posted September 2, 2017 They're not flying because they are crap... I recall a TAA Viscount crashed-one our worst. List of accidents and incidents involving the Vickers Viscount - Wikipedia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty_d Posted September 2, 2017 Share Posted September 2, 2017 Funny, I was just looking up a Vickers Viscount (G-ALWF) as it was on a TV show I'm watching - "The Crown". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Perry Posted September 2, 2017 Author Share Posted September 2, 2017 I recall a TAA Viscount crashed-one our worst.List of accidents and incidents involving the Vickers Viscount - Wikipedia I have not looked at the Wiki reference yet, but I seem to recall a Viscount incident from the sixties I think, in an oldish crash investigation book I found at a flea market. There was a fire inside one of the wings, could've been the left one. . overheating pump of some sort. . .the crew knew about it and tried to get the aircraft down, but the fire consumed a major structural part of the wing and at 4,000 + feet, the wing gave up. . . . Very sad. I liked the DH Heron, 4 engined beastie. BEA used to have some of those and I traveled on them a couple of times on my Dad's business trips. I was so impressed I bought the Airfix model. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
facthunter Posted September 4, 2017 Share Posted September 4, 2017 That plane crashed near Winton Qld. An Ansett ANA plane with a cabin compressor fire. The case is made of magnesium and the heat affected wing spar failed. Another of the fleet had a similar fire but was able to divert to Mangalore, safely. The MMA plane in WA resulted in the type being grounded, for a while. It turned out to be some time after replacement wing spar caps were incorrectly installed and a scratch on a hole when a pin was inserted caused a crack to form. The other plane in Botany bay was after it entered a storm just after take off.( No radar fitted in them (and others) up till then, but it was soon after, as a result of this crash) I believe the initial failure was the horizontal stabiliser(s) in down load. It took quite a while to find it when it had only gone a few miles. Fortunately it had few passengers on it and was the last flight to Melbourne out of Sydney, that day. Nev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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