Has the USA's Politico-Economic system failed?

[old man emu]

I wonder if the USA's politico-economic system is another in a long line of societal systems that have failed to sustain the ideals on which it was based.

 

Quite clearly the current system concentrates political power and wealth in the hands of a small minority of the population, leaving another minority in dire straits and the bulk of the population just getting by. As a result, many of the people directly effected by the system (ie the American People) seem to have opted out of their chance to involve themselves in the basic levels of its operation.

 

Is the USA's system to be another system that we shall see go by the wayside? So far in the past 120 years we have seen monarchies overthrown, empires dissolved, socialist and fascist systems fail, dictatorships overthrown and two approaches to communism modified to meet new political arrangements or economic growth. All these have been experiments to find ways to satisfactorily what Maslow described as the Hierarchy of needs. [ATTACH]48072._xfImport[/ATTACH]

 

Are humans, the only animal that preys on its own species, only able to exist in societies governed by political or economic warlords?

 

Old Man Emu

 

[Marty_d]

I had a robust discussion with a couple of workmates today. I pointed out that the highest-paid hedge fund managers in the USA pull down about a billion dollars a year - each. I then suggested that if they were to donate 1 year's earnings (which they could easily do, as they make another billion next year) to one of the lowest GDP countries, such as Liberia, they could make a huge difference to the lives of millions.

 

My colleagues were both of the opinion that it'd be a waste of money, in that it'd either go to corrupt officials, or if health and longevity were to improve, the population would just have more kids and drive themselves back into poverty.

 

My opinion is quite different and similar to this bloke:

 

Hans Rosling: The best stats you've ever seen | TED Talk | TED.com

 

But this conversation was quite disturbing to me. If a couple of average-paid, usually Labor-voting middle class blokes think that it's a fair thing that wealth be so densely concentrated in the hands of a few, what chance do we have to change anything?

 

 

[storchy neil]

what so as the dictator of the poor country can put it on an aeroplane and fly away neil

 

 

[Marty_d]

what so as the dictator of the poor country can put it on an aeroplane and fly away neil

As I said to them, there's ways of giving that don't involve the corrupt officials getting everything. Build infrastructure (schools, universities, hospitals). Scholarships for bright students to become doctors, teachers, etc, so they can go back and help their country. Yes you may have to pay some bribes along the way but you should be able to get a high percentage of the money used for intended purpose.

 

 

[dutchroll]

....... or if health and longevity were to improve, the population would just have more kids and drive themselves back into poverty.

They actually believe that big improvements in health, education and longevity drives people to have more kids and end up in poverty?

 

In reality, the opposite effect is demonstrated when you improve these things. People have less kids and the workforce is more productive (but you have to include education in the mix).

 

 

[Yenn]

Health, education and longevity have improved all over the world. The population does grow more slowly as there are less kids produced.

 

The education seems to be not of much use when the elected leaders then allow lots of poor. uneducated and non assimilating people into the country, with the effect of alienating the whole population.

 

I am not talking of Australia alone but include Europe.

 

All that education is not much use without intelligence.

 

 

[nomadpete]

Welcome to the forum, Chixaluv.

 

Your sentiments are echoed by many Australians. But what is the answer? Simple wealth redistribution is impossible because it would be handled by humans.

 

 

[Yenn]

Chixaluv. A lot of people are not fooled by the supposed American way of life.I would far rather live in Australia than the USA, and yes we do have some immigrants that don't want to assimilate and want to keep their old lifestyle. That includes a lot of Yanks, who have deserted the sinking ship and come over here. As with all Yanks, they are really nice people and they think the USA is the world leader in all that is good. But the politicial system in the USA really shows us what a mess it is. I think one of the very few people of influence to see what was happening in the last Presidential election was Michael Moore. Sadly few listened to him and now they are regretting what happened.

 

 

[facthunter]

Chix, you are right to be fearful. It can't end well as GREED and self serving traits are pre eminent. In the USA only the winner is noticed. CLEVER businesses don't pay their workers. Good guys come last .Religion ? Where are the good effects? Americans as individuals are very friendly but the system stinks. You elected Trump (sort of) He will only make it worse. There's a sort of all pervading madness with Money, Guns, Lawyers being too important. US has milked the world, Been it's policeman, Let off all the atom bombs, been bully exploiting capitalists as an alternative to colonisation. Trade agreement that exploit other Countries and artificially increase US Dollar value and purchasing power. WAR keeps Industry going. Those who do OK are $#!T scared of anything smelling of socialism or caring for the less well off. It would reduce THEIR excessive standard of living which they wont give up. so the poor get what they deserve NOTHING. Their God is money their church is big business and they are slaves to consumerism, and hardly any of them would understand one word of what I'm saying. Otherwise everything's OK if the stock indices on Wall St are rising, and China would disappear and the rest of the world do as they're told. Nev

 

 

[old man emu]

Wouldn't you love it if the leader of one of the Western Democracies said what the English Prime Minister (Hugh Grant) said in the movie "Love Actually"?

 

Press Conference Reporter: Mr. President, has it been a good visit?

 

The President of the U.S.: Very satisfactory indeed. We got what we came for and our special relationship is still very special.

 

Press Conference Reporter: Prime Minister?

 

Prime Minister: I love that word "relationship". Covers all manner of sins, doesn't it? I fear that this has become a bad relationship. A relationship based on the President taking exactly what he wants and casually ignoring all those things that really matter to Britain. We may be a small country but we're a great one, too. The country of Shakespeare, Churchill, the Beatles, Sean Connery, Harry Potter. David Beckham's right foot. David Beckham's left foot, come to that. And a friend who bullies us is no longer a friend. And since bullies only respond to strength, from now onward, I will be prepared to be much stronger. And the President should be prepared for that.

 

Yeah, Malcolm. Dare you to stand up and talk like that!!!!!

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

What's happened to the leader of the free world? That awesome nation that gave us NASA and National Geographic?

 

It allowed corporate greed to take control of the political system, which became entrenched under Reagan. He raised spending and cut taxes, sending the US into a debt spiral. He removed controls on the financial sector, which exploded in size and power. Now, very few of America's biggest firms actually build anything- they grow fat by manipulating the money system, which is approaching a catastrophic collapse.

 

The average American worker is now far worse off (if they're lucky enough to have a real job) and the legendary generosity of Americans is facing enormous strains. Many civil societies might struggle thru the coming chaos, but America is riven by social divides and awash with firearms.

 

In the 1930's Roosevelt was able to unite the people and pull them thru the Great Depression. That was a time when people trusted their leaders and would make sacrifices for the national good. Even Obama couldn't unite today's America; Trump is dividing it, and is very likely to take the US into yet another war within months. Very depressing.

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

Average weekly earnings of working people in USA:

 

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[Marty_d]

Wouldn't you love it if the leader of one of the Western Democracies said what the English Prime Minister (Hugh Grant) said in the movie "Love Actually"?Press Conference Reporter: Mr. President, has it been a good visit?

 

The President of the U.S.: Very satisfactory indeed. We got what we came for and our special relationship is still very special.

 

Press Conference Reporter: Prime Minister?

 

Prime Minister: I love that word "relationship". Covers all manner of sins, doesn't it? I fear that this has become a bad relationship. A relationship based on the President taking exactly what he wants and casually ignoring all those things that really matter to Britain. We may be a small country but we're a great one, too. The country of Shakespeare, Churchill, the Beatles, Sean Connery, Harry Potter. David Beckham's right foot. David Beckham's left foot, come to that. And a friend who bullies us is no longer a friend. And since bullies only respond to strength, from now onward, I will be prepared to be much stronger. And the President should be prepared for that.

 

Yeah, Malcolm. Dare you to stand up and talk like that!!!!!

Love that movie - we watch it every christmas (this year we've already watched it as we're going overseas tomorrow).

 

However whenever I see that scene I think "No world leader would talk like that - it's tantamount to a declaration of war". Not that any of the plot lines are overly realistic.

 

 

[Old Koreelah]

Wouldn't you love it if the leader of one of the Western Democracies said what the English Prime Minister...

Shirley you mean the British PM, OME.

 

No wonder the poor forgotten Scots, Welsh, Nth Irish, Cornish, Manx, Channel Islanders, etc. want to secede!

 

 

[kgwilson]

OME, the answer to the title of the thread is YES. The American population is in 2 major camps. Those who are ignorant & believe everything they are told on right wing TV, i.e Trump supporters (they say No) and those who know it has failed but do not accept it (they say No too but don't really believe themselves). The big end of town (Corporates and wealthy individuals) need to keep the myth "all is well" alive or they will lose their shirt. They can't afford to let this happen.