Execution.

[M61A1]

Will the execution of Andrew Chan and Myuran Sukumaran, make any different to the ongoing illicit drug use?.........I believe it won`t!!!

Frank.

Well, they wont do it again.

 

 

[Ozfergie]

I am only new to the sport but at the recent Royal Easter Show, a couple of RAS committee members told me that light aircraft are the biggest mode of transport for drug cargo in northern NSW and Qld - rumour or grain of truth?

 

 

[farri]

Well, they wont do it again.

Absolutely correct! but they hadn`t been doing it for the last 10 years,either.

 

http://www.dw.de/unodc-indonesia-is-a-major-drug-trafficking-hub/a-18231494

 

Frank.

 

 

[octave]

http://www.businessinsider.com.au/its-lucky-the-bali-bombers-didnt-have-drugs-on-them-2015-2

[robinsm]

people tend to forget that these people are worse than murderers. They affect many people, not just their immediate family and they do it for greed. They spread despair, disease and crime. The shooting of these 2 individuals has taken 2 pieces of evil off the streets and maybe saved a large number of lives. The stuff they were trafficing in, for money and greed, is the stuff that makes people commit crime, splits up families and condemns the victims to a life of misery and hardship. Good riddance to bad rubbish I say.

 

 

[PA.]

Wouldn't it be ironic if they hid drugs in the coffins. How much did they weigh?

 

 

[octave]

The shooting of these 2 individuals has taken 2 pieces of evil off the streets and maybe saved a large number of lives.

I don't understand your logic, they weren't "on the streets" they were in jail

 

 

[Butch]

Do you really think the 2 Bali nine that were executed would have become a preacher and a painter if they hadn't been caught!

 

I think not, more likely to be pimp and a pusher driving around in flash cars taking advantage of the easily led and the hopeless.

 

I'm glad they had to spend 10 years of hell waiting to die so they could experience what it's like being an addict going through hell waiting to die in the gutter on the end of a needle.

 

Maybe now one less mule will think twice before they decide to carry drugs into Australia.

 

I have a teenage daughter and son, to me these people are the scum of the earth, not only do they wreck there own lives but they try and corrupt innocent kids like mine .

 

How much money has our Government wasted on trying to save the lives of these money for crime people?

 

I know it's a shocking wast of life, but it's war ! them or us. Remind yourself, one day someone close to you could be hanging off the end of a needle and who would you blame?

 

 

[Happyflyer]

The hypocrisy of our politicians and others over these executions is breath taking. Our biggest trading partners kill many more people than Indonesia. China kills over 1000 every year, the US killed 35 last year but not a peep, no candle light vigils. Plenty of holiday makers still going to those places (and plenty of Pollies on 'study trips'). The media has been working itself up into self righteous frenzy (and behaved appallingly to the families of the executed). I suppose Australian lives are worth more than American or Chinese lives.

 

As to whether the death penalty is deterrent or not. The publicity that this has stirred up surely will deter many from offending. It is a fact that not one person executed has ever re-offended.

 

 

[facthunter]

The lawyers did it "Pro Bono". I salute their attempts.

 

Killing people should not be condoned in a civilised society or done by a government. If you place no value on a life you don't do much for anyone. Indonesia is not the only place. As Yenn says. The USA has a lot on death row, mostly blacks who haven't had any one to defend them in court. Some have been released as a result of modern DNA testing being declared innocent of the charge(s). A lot of these thing are politically motivated. Don't get between a politician and power.

 

Indonesia is a SOURCE of drugs or at least a place they flow through. The drugs were going TO Australia. More "foreigners" get nabbed than locals. Nev

 

 

[Guest Andys@coffs]

It is a fact that not one person executed has ever re-offended.

As it is also a fact that every person ever executed, is guilty of something!, not necessarily what was used to cause the government sanctioned killing mind you...but lets not quibble over things like innocence or guilt! That isn't relevant to this specific case, the 2 involved have absolutely acknowledged and accepted responsibility for their actions...the first true step on the way to change in my opinion.......

 

People who take drugs are looked at as victims and we do all that we can to help them change their life....those like low down drug mules in what way are they different.....both user and mule are just resources to be used and thrown away by the Mr Big's of the drug world....Life is rarely black and White. Looking at it and forcing things into black or white generally means we will end up spending effort and energy solving an issue that can never be solved in terms of absolutes....

 

As an example, surely if we killed all addicts, by application of death penalty then the market for the sellers of drugs dries up......That's an absolute approach to the problem and yet people will claim I'm an idiot for suggesting it...personally I don't see that much of a difference between the two approaches myself (and for clarity neither are acceptable to me personally)

 

Andy

 

 

[fly_tornado]

Indo restored its national pride with these executions, the display of force was designed to remind the indo people that Indo won't back down to Australian political pressure.

 

 

[dazza 38]

The hypocrisy of our politicians and others over these executions is breath taking. Our biggest trading partners kill many more people than Indonesia. China kills over 1000 every year, the US killed 35 last year but not a peep, no candle light vigils. Plenty of holiday makers still going to those places (and plenty of Pollies on 'study trips'). The media has been working itself up into self righteous frenzy (and behaved appallingly to the families of the executed). I suppose Australian lives are worth more than American or Chinese lives.

As to whether the death penalty is deterrent or not. The publicity that this has stirred up surely will deter many from offending. It is a fact that not one person executed has ever re-offended.

Not exactly, Indonesia kill thousands of West Papuans every year. But that isn't executions, it is Genocide.

 

 

[dazza 38]

There is a lot of passionate and heated discussion about the events that happened this morning. We have to remember that there is two things guaranteed in life, death and taxes.

 

I do think at the end of the day, it is a waste of life and death is so permanent. I do agree that drug dealers have to be punished but these events prove to me that the Indonesian government are no different than the barbaric ISIL. ( guys do some research on how the West Papuan people have been treated.)

 

I know that drug dealers suppling hard drugs are indirectly murderers. And most criminals are always sorry when they are put into the back of a Police car. And yes there is a massive sign at the airport saying blah blah about drugs.

 

But from all accounts these two guys have genuinely been reformed over the last two years.

 

Just something to think about.

 

 

[rankamateur]

Not exactly, Indonesia kill thousands of West Papuans every year. But that isn't executions, it is Genocide.

I read tonight that even the Red Cross has been booted out of West Papua. Could be a good thing, now their helicopters can't be used as gun ships to take out the careful native chiefs. My support for Red Cross evaporated the day I watched the video of a Red Cross "relief drop" with a machine gun trained out each side of the chopper. Poor beggars didn't stand a chance.

 

 

[robinsm]

There is a lot of passionate and heated discussion about the events that happened this morning. We have to remember that there is two things guaranteed in life, death and taxes.I do think at the end of the day, it is a waste of life and death is so permanent. I do agree that drug dealers have to be punished but these events prove to me that the Indonesian government are no different than the barbaric ISIL. ( guys do some research on how the West Papuan people have been treated.)

 

I know that drug dealers suppling hard drugs are indirectly murderers. And most criminals are always sorry when they are put into the back of a Police car. And yes there is a massive sign at the airport saying blah blah about drugs.

 

But from all accounts these two guys have genuinely been reformed over the last two years.

 

Just something to think about.

Does their reform include patching up the lives of those they have made victims, helping the families and children of their indirect victims? Is it ok to say sorry and be forgiven all of their past crap. Remember, its not about them, its about the hundreds of victims of their crimes and the sorrow and anguish, along with the ruined lives and deaths from overdoses. Dont give me the peace, love and mung beans sob story, good riddance I say, someone is taking out the garbage and maybe they will pay in the here after. Feel sorry for the people they have stuffed up, not them, they have do not have to face this any more.

 

 

[farri]

Do you really think the 2 Bali nine that were executed would have become a preacher and a painter if they hadn't been caught!I think not, more likely to be pimp and a pusher driving around in flash cars taking advantage of the easily led and the hopeless.

Your opinion and not relevant, because the fact is they were caught.

 

I'm glad they had to spend 10 years of hell waiting to die so they could experience what it's like being an addict going through hell waiting to die in the gutter on the end of a needle.

Unless the drugs were forcefully injected,without the persons consent, they made the decision to put the needle into themselves! As far as I`m concerned, the users are part of the problem and the drug issue will never be solved, while users are seen as victims!

 

Maybe now one less mule will think twice before they decide to carry drugs into Australia

Possibly!

 

How much money has our Government wasted on trying to save the lives of these money for crime people?.

How much money has the government spent ( taxpayer $ ), trying to help addicts? Unless the policy has changed, free needles have been handed out to addicts for many years, the rest of us have to pay for the medications we need. Most public toilets have a container to dispose of used needles

 

one day someone close to you could be hanging off the end of a needle

If there were no free needles handed out, just maybe, there would be fewer hanging off the end of one!.But then again! I suppose they would either steal or become dealers, to buy them.

 

Frank.

 

 

[dazza 38]

I read tonight that even the Red Cross has been booted out of West Papua. Could be a good thing, now their helicopters can't be used as gun ships to take out the careful native chiefs. My support for Red Cross evaporated the day I watched the video of a Red Cross "relief drop" with a machine gun trained out each side of the chopper. Poor beggars didn't stand a chance.

• You may want to let Doug Evans know this since he gave me a creative for my post.
   
  

 

 

[dazza 38]

Does their reform include patching up the lives of those they have made victims, helping the families and children of their indirect victims? Is it ok to say sorry and be forgiven all of their past crap. Remember, its not about them, its about the hundreds of victims of their crimes and the sorrow and anguish, along with the ruined lives and deaths from overdoses. Dont give me the peace, love and mung beans sob story, good riddance I say, someone is taking out the garbage and maybe they will pay in the here after. Feel sorry for the people they have stuffed up, not them, they have do not have to face this any more.

Everybody has choices in life mate, like taking drugs.

 

 

[alf jessup]

All I will say on it is thank fire truck it's over, all the drivel in the media was painful portraying these 2 as model prisoners, they knew the risk, they took the gamble and they were the ringleaders not the mules, they fought the law in Indonesia and the law won.

 

Got what they deserved, only barbaric thing I didn't like was they shot them, I feel a hot dose of the crap they were peddling would have been far better as the firing squad just doesn't sit right in this day and age with me.

 

I have never had an inkling to travel to Bali and never will, not that there aren't decent people there but it's just not on my bucket list of things to do, I worked in India for 5 months and that was an eye opener with some real nice people and some real nice corruption going on there so I am just guessing it wouldn't be much different in Indonesia.

 

A few days time we will hear no more from the media or the government on this and that I am glad for, IMO the government was just putting on a show to make it's self look good for the supporters and if it was serious about saving them they are real W#nkers as these 2 were tax evading drug pushing low life's, not your average hard working tax paying Australian.

 

You reap what you sow.

 

 

[Russ]

Legalise the lot of them, handed out by ??? And to make it more attractive.....

 

They're free, as much as they like.

 

Can see a booming market in coffin making as a consequence, another winner would be......no drug related crimes, I can leave me house unlocked again, like it was yrs ago.

 

Just one condition tho......you take drugs, don't ask for our medics at the emergency wards to bust their arses bringing you back from near death by an overdose. You're on your own.

 

 

[503]

Why not.the war on drugs is not going to be won

 

 

[Marty_d]

There's a few parts to this story that need a closer look than the knee-jerk "good riddance to bad rubbish" reactions.

 

Firstly, they were taking drugs through Indonesia. Not into Indonesia. They weren't poisoning the population of Indonesia. The drugs were going to Australia, so the AFP, knowing that Indonesia has the death penalty for drug smugglers, should have let them board the flight and arrest them in Australia. It's not like they were going to escape between there and here. Funny that they now do this but unbelievable that 10 years ago, no-one stopped to think of the possible consequences. Political expediency perhaps - did Indonesia need a win with drug arrests so there was a temporary advantage to our relationship with them to toss them a bone? Well that's worked out well hasn't it!

 

Point 2. Illicit drugs. Only illicit because of an arbitrary decision that one set of drugs is illegal and others aren't. Tobacco and alcohol kill far more people than heroin but there's no way in hell they're going to become illegal. Nor should they - I'm not arguing that. I'm saying legalise everything, tax it, regulate it and sell it with guaranteed quality, counselling at point of sale, referral to psych assistance/housing/etc. Why? Because then drug-related crime disappears. Kids killing themselves by taking drugs cut with all sorts of toxic substances - no longer happens. Users are identified and can be given assistance to stop. Before you argue that it'd mean an increase in use - it wouldn't. An example I heard once compared a current legal drug, eg vodka, with illegal drugs. We can go buy as much vodka as we want right now and spend every day p1ssed out of our brains. We don't (at least, most of us don't.) Why? Because we have fulfilling lives, jobs, families, aircraft, etc. We can enjoy a drink every now and then but spend most days totally sober. Same thing with "illicit" drugs, if they were no longer illicit most people wouldn't run out and shoot up on heroin every day, because we have lives. The "war on drugs" that the USA has been running since the 60's has not stopped or even decreased the number of addicts. It's filled their prisons to overflowing with petty criminals (mostly young black men), filled the morgues with OD's, drug related gun deaths, drug cartels (with all the civilian death and suffering they cause) and all the other consequences of pushing the problem underground. Not to mention the financial cost, in 2010 alone the US government spent $15 billion on the war on drugs.

 

Point 3. Corruption. Indonesia's justice system is not yet a beacon of clarity. If there's any truth to recent claims from the Bali 9's original lawyer, the judges were prepared to accept a billion baht (AUD $130,000) to return a sentence of under 20 years. However they then came back and said they'd been ordered to give the death sentence. Attempts to get Indonesia's anti-corruption authorities to investigate this prior to the execution met with silence. Political interference in the judiciary?

 

Point 4. Rehabilitation. While I'm generally skeptical of prisoner rehabilitation, especially the way they suddenly find Jesus just before parole hearings, by all accounts these guys had genuinely turned into helpful, nice people. They'd already spent longer in prison than most criminals here get for murder. We know that the death penalty is not a deterrent. What was the point of killing these men?

 

Point 5. Consequences. I am not naive enough to believe that there will be any long-term consequences for Indonesia over this, but let's consider what happens short term. In return for Joko to appear politically strong to the Indonesian public, by executing several foreign nationals he has lowered Indonesia's image in their countries of origin. This will have a short term impact on their tourism & trade industries, but even a short term impact could run into millions in lost revenue. Internally it may assist him politically for a short while. Was it worth it for the country?

 

Point 6. The death penalty. It doesn't work. That's why most what we consider "developed" countries don't have it, and its days are numbered in those that do. Plus there's all those times they've subsequently discovered the person was innocent of the crime. Oops. Besides that, it's barbaric, and must have psychological impacts on those tasked with carrying it out. It's one thing to kill someone in the heat of battle, or police killing an armed offender (as opposed to shooting an unarmed one in the back as recently happened in the US) - quite another to have to take the life of someone tied to a post, or strapped to a table, or whatever the method is.

 

So that's my rant for the day.

 

 

[fly_tornado]

Coca Cola was once the polite way to take cocaine, if your dentist didn't have any.

 

Morphine was supposed to cure opium addiction and heroine was supposed to cure morphine addiction.

 

 

 

[SDQDI]

Sorry Marty I stopped reading when I saw you say 'legalise everything'

 

While we mightn't have everything in perspective we still need some things to be illegal. I certainly wouldn't be happy to have 'ice' and 'heroin' and all the rest of them legalised. It doesn't matter how legal you make it it all still fries your brains and no amount of counselling at the selling point would fix it.

 

I'm with Bex, I have a sibling and her partner addicted to weed and ice and no matter how much support and help they are given they still go back and go to great lengths to get their next fix and the worst part is the attitude that the world owes them everything, they don't want a job as it takes away from their high time and between the dole and selling the odd item they have enough to get by (high)

 

I don't agree with killing people as punishment but that is the law in Indonesia and the way the media has carried on IMHO is disgraceful. Indonesia has as much right to do what they have done as we do locking up foreigners for crimes committed while here. Yes it would have been nice to let them spend the rest of their lives in jail instead of shooting them but the way that we (Australia and australian media) have been carrying on I'd be surprised if they just didn't get sick of our whingeing and shoot them to shut us up.