Debunking the First Fleet myth.

[Marty_d]

Sacre bleu! You are navigues sur mon fleuve sans me payer? C'est intolerable!

It is time I close ze Strait of Marty. Pierre! Preparez l'avion automatique!

[nomadpete]

13 hours ago, Marty_d said:

Sacre bleu! You are navigues sur mon fleuve sans me payer? C'est intolerable!

It is time I close ze Strait of Marty. Pierre! Preparez l'avion automatique!

See how easily a well intentioned comment can lead to an international crisis!

 

To misquote a well known (ex) president.... "The bombing will begin after lunchtime"

 

Edited July 8 by nomadpete

[old man emu]

A little update on this topic from some further research.

 

I said that one reason for the colony was to provide a base from which to establish on Norfolk Island for access to those tall pines for masts and the flax for sail canvas. Wood and fabric were not the constraints on both the naval and mercantile fleets of Britain. It was the amount of rope needed to operate the sails. A Man-o-War could require 80 tons (yes old measure) of rope in its rigging. 

 

Britain was getting most of this from Russia, but in the early 1780s, Catherine the Great of Russia began limiting trade in hemp with Britain. At this time Russia was starting to expand its territory and Britain was an obvious competitor. When plans were being made to establish a presence in Australia, the growing of hemp for rope-making was high on the agenda. Sir Joseph Banks supported this plan and supplied hemp seed as part of the agricultural supplies sent with the Fleet. 

 

Hemp was  most likely planted by settlers William and Archibald Bell in 1823. The hemp cultivation was part of Australia's early colonial economy, as Cannabis sativa seeds first arrived in Australia in 1788 on the First Fleet at the request of Sir Joseph Banks, with the British envisioning Australia as a commercial hemp-producing colony.

[nomadpete]

2 minutes ago, old man emu said:

Catherine the Great of Russia began limiting trade in hemp with Britain.

So, you expect me to believe that Trumpy didn't invent tariff wars? Or that tariffs might have long term problen for the world?

 

Shocked, I am. Shocked!

[old man emu]

Just to clear up the terminology.

 

"Tariff": A tariff is a tax applied by a government to goods brought in from other countries. Key purposes include raising government money, protecting local businesses from foreign competition, and acting as a tool in political trade talks. Other names for the same thing are "import tax" and "custom duty".

 

Most countries employed tariffs, but it seems that in recent years global free trade arrangements and globalisation of manufacturing have reduced their importance to individual countries, unless as a political weapon as we have seen with the USA.

 

"Export duty": An export duty is a tax charged by a government on goods leaving a country. 

 

[nomadpete]

4 hours ago, old man emu said:

with the British envisioning Australia as a commercial hemp-producing colony.

They were right about that bit....... sort of.

 

 

[nomadpete]

What happened to those original hemp attempts?

 

I don't remember any mention of it when we were at school

 

And I don't know what invoked 'Underscore'. 

[facthunter]

It ran on RUM instead. . NSW.  Nev

[nomadpete]

8 minutes ago, facthunter said:

It ran on RUM instead. . NSW.  Nev

That was the local economy.

 

But coinidentally, The Old Empire was losing its ability to 'rule the waves', at about that time.

[old man emu]

5 hours ago, nomadpete said:

What happened to those original hemp attempts? I don't remember any mention of it when we were at school

Ultimately the need for hemp was diminished by the introduction of steam power and later oil and nuclear to propel ships. It is interesting that the commercial cultivation of hemp is being revived as a renewable source of fibre for products ranging from clothing to bulding materials, foodstuffs and many other things. With proper processing hemp can be like the farmer's pig from which every part is used except the grunt. There are several species of hemp, some of which produce theTHC that is the narcotic. I haven't found out which species is the non-THC producer that is grown for fibre etc. 

 

The plan to develop hemp production in thenew colony wasn't mentioned, and continues not to be mentioned in history classes is due to the maintenance of the "crowded hulks" myth.

 

3 hours ago, facthunter said:

It ran on RUM instead. . NSW.  Nev

No Nev. The use of rum as a currency ended in 1808 when Macquarie became Govenor. I imagine that the need for the colony to produce food for its people took a higher priority for some time. It looks like it ws not until nearly forty years later that the colony was established enough to look at hemp as a suitable product to grow. 

 

3 hours ago, nomadpete said:

The Old Empire was losing its ability to 'rule the waves', at about that time.

Britain still ruled the waves up until WWI, and don't forget that Britain's mercantile marine has always had heaps more ships than the Navy and in the 19th Century, even up to the early 20th Century sail ruled. 
 

[nomadpete]

OME,

You mentioned (I think) that the first fleet brought hemp seeds with the intent of starting a hemp industry.

 

We are familiar with the popular first fleet stories. 

 

Did you find any documentary evidence to support your view on the first fleet intending to start hemp industry? Particularly with regard to that influencing the intention to colonise?

 

It's an interesting angle.

Edited August 8 by nomadpete

[old man emu]

Mea culpa, mea culpa, mea maxima culpa! I didn't record the various sources that I found when I was researching the question, so I can't post them here. Needless to say that I did find the references in order to satisfy my curiosity. The following is an extract from this Wikipedia entry summarises what I found. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hunter_Valley_cannabis_infestation 

 

Cannabis sativa seeds first arrived in Australia in 1788 on the First Fleet at the request of Sir Joseph Banks. The blueprint for the New South Wales colony, approved by the British Cabinet in 1786, envisaged Australia as a commercial colony producing hemp.

 

The blueprint for the New South Wales colony was created for the British parliament in 1786. Banks provided a supply of seed. However, the British were too optomistic about the rate of establishment ot teh colony which would have failed due to starvation had Governor Phillip not done all he could to keep everyone alive, but on meagre rations until replenishment occured. Settle yourself down and watch this video which will enlighten you as to the first ten years of the colony. The video is an Australian prodcution aand one of a series dealing with early British colonisation of Australia.

 

 

[old man emu]

I've come to the conclusion that my hypothesis is WRONG. The British did not go to Botany Bay to establish a base for agriculture and commerce. They went there to create a dumping ground to releive the congestion in the hulks and prisons which were filled with souls whose crimes we now consider to be at the lowest end of criminality.

 

I've reached this conclusion through a bit more reading. My main source that lead me to this conclusion is the book 1788 by David Hill. (See notes below for book identification)

 

From this book I learned thatin 1717 the British parliament passed an Act which enabled the transportation of felons to foreign shores. At that time those shores were those of the American colonies, to which some forty thousand convicts were taransported (into slavery) over the following sixty years. Convicts committed to transportatin were sold by theo goalers to the shipping contactors, who took them actoss the Atlantic and sold the prisoners to plantation owners for the duration of their sentences.

 

In 1777, the Parliament  passed the Hulk Act, which allowed for the confinement of convicts in decommissioned British naval vessels on the Thames and other English rivers and ports. This was seen as a temporary measure until the American insurrection was quashed, but those colonies were granted independence in 1783 through the Treaty of Paris. leaving Britain with no place to transport convicts to, and crowding began to get bad in the hulks. So, based on the promptings of Sir Joseph Banks that the east coast of New South Wales (as Cook named it) would be a great place, in depth plans were made to sens an advance party to establish a colony to which thousands of convicts could be sent in future. 

 

The problem with Botany Bay was/is that it is no good for agriculture. (I grew up on its shores, and I know what the soil is like - crap.) Joseph Banks doesn’t come out of it very well.  He enthused about Australia as a verdant land of opportunity when (a) his own notes were less effusive, and (b) he’d seen hardly anything of the place and was only here for a week. All he had done was collect a lot of plants. He obviously knew nothing of the requirements for agriculture.

 

If these comments raise your interest in that bit of histroy, I recommend the book to you. After reading it, you will wonder at the survival of those convicts, Marines and officials during their first few years on these Fatal Shores. You can chase up the book with these details:

Author: David Hill
Title: 1788, The Brutal Truth of the First Fleet,
Publisher: Random House (William Heinemann)
ISBN: 9781741668001