Is GA going to take over RAAUs?

[nomadpete]

Comment by Middleton, in an ABC article about ATSB scope of investigations....

 

"Swan Hill chief flying instructor and former RAAus board member Alan Middleton said .....  the two systems were unnecessary and no longer justified and called on CASA to regain control of pilot and aircraft registration."

 

Food for thought.

 

 

[nomadpete]

Further, he reportedly said....

 

"CASA needs to take back under their umbrella all aspects of aviation that involve aircraft and pilots being licensed," Mr Middleton said.

"[Aircraft and pilots] will then fly in the CASA system … in what would be the public road system for our airways across Australia."

Edited September 4 by nomadpete

[Jerry_Atrick]

In the UK, the CAA is responsible for all licencing, including the NPPL (which is similar, I guess to the RAAus licences/certificates). It does delegate the ability to manage and in a limitied form regulate licennsing to the various representative bodies (LAA for the LSA type stuff, BMA for microlights, and BGA for gliding). It has some advantages such as the samle level of access to contolled airspace as PPLs, radio telephony is allowed, etc. Of course, it may require a but more training up front, but the medical requirements and training are less than that of a PPL. Also, the hours flown are directly creditable to a PPL. For a lot of people that move to PPL, it is a medical and a fee - that is it. In addition, although not ICAO, these NPPLs can be used in LSAs in most other European countries and I think the USA and CAN without any furhter admin forms, etc. 

 

So, in and of itself, it is not a bad thing. Of course, there are down sides. For example, I think the hours required and the theory is probably more than the RAAus ticket. And the medical requirements may be higher. However, it largely works OK as the local representative bodies administer them, authorise examiners, etc, and can regulate above the minimum requirements if they deem it appropriate. Also, all air crashes that involve airframe wrte off or death are investigated by the AAIB regardless of registration. And the registration is G-, just like GA. 

 

Of course, it is considered by many here as well administered (at least last time I looked.. which I haven't for a few years now - @Red may have a different view). When I came ot the UK, I thought the UK CAA were eminently more pragmatic than CASA in the application of rules, but people here complained about them, and yeah, there were some things they were not great at. But there is a GA specialist unit now in the CAA (or was) and that covered all light aircraft (so a little of a misnomer). 

 

The question is will you get anything better or worse under CASA?

[nomadpete]

The details of Australian  Self Managed Administration have been pretty much done to death in the Flying forum. 

 

What caught my eye, was the fact that a (ex) member of the board of RAAUS has publicly said that CASA should cancel the exemtions under which we fly recreational aircraft (I assume he means ALL Self Managed organisations inc gliding, etc) and take on the admin, licencing, registration, training & liability for everyone in the air. Regardless of what they fly.

 

At least that might result in investigation of all aviation fatalities.

 

Is he just stirring up an argument? Was he perhaps disenchanted by his experience at the board of RAAUS Incorporated?

Edited September 4 by nomadpete

[Jerry_Atrick]

Is he taking a job at CASA?

[spacesailor]

is " CASA " , short of bureaucrats ? .

spacesailor

[nomadpete]

1 hour ago, spacesailor said:

is " CASA " , short of bureaucrats ? .

spacesailor

A bureaucrazy can never have enough....

[facthunter]

Middo is a person who should be listened to.  Nev

[nomadpete]

8 hours ago, facthunter said:

Middo is a person who should be listened to.  Nev

Well he seems to suggest it's time to close the administration loop. 

To have only One overarching administration and set of laws for all flying machines. 

 

I wonder how that will work out.

 

[facthunter]

Isn't NZ like that?   Nev

[spacesailor]

Wasn't the UK only one " G " registration! , too

Have they gone to that ' ultralight ' part 103 .

spacesailor

[Jerry_Atrick]

Yes.. all powered aicraft (maybe except paramotors) are G reg

 

It covers microlights and ultralights

 

 

Edited Wednesday at 05:34 AM by Jerry_Atrick

[Jerry_Atrick]

I don't profess to know anything about the RAAus scene apart from what I have read on the brother site, and it is sometimes conflicting. 

 

But I can only relate to how it works here. The LAA (UK equivalent of RAAus: https://www.lightaircraftassociation.co.uk/) has delegated authority over the engineering standards and enforcement of light aircraft. This means the LAA, which is staffed as I recall mainly by volunteers with a few salaried roles, defines and manages the permit to fly (sort of equivlent of airworthiness standards), rules, inspection requirements, etc largelty free of CAA oversight. This seems to work very well. Licensing is administered by the LAA, but the rules are set by the CAA. Obviously, the LAA lobby the CAA on what those rules should be. 

 

As mentioned, all powered aircraft, and I think gliders all get a G reg. Even single seat deregulated aircraft (deregulated being a little misnomer) get G reg.. I don't think the CAA want to overly complicate things - the aircraft type and nature of registration tell you what classification it is regulated under. The UK system allow some GA types types, including Warriors and I think lower powered 172s to be registered under LAA/LSA regs.. so home maintenance, lower licensing requirements etc. As I recall an aircraft can cross from GA to LAA, but not back (presumably because of the lack of paperwork at that time). I think it is a silly rule as long as proof of engineering to GA standards at the time you want to cross back is evident. 

 

It all seems to work OK.. There are "struts", which are local equivalents of branches of the LAA dotted all over the country. The Devon strut was based at Dunkeswell, about 1/2 hour drive from me, and although I am GA, used to attend events and meetings regularly. There wasn't much politics that I could see and it was great comraderie and about enjoying the pastime/hobby/sport. I have been a member of the LAA on and off as I think of dabbling in the LSA world, but also to contribute to a community that is regularly under threat from development, NIMBYs and the like. More people who join, the louder the voice is (I am also an AOPA member even though my wings are clipped at the moment).  I was also toyinh with the idea of bringing in the ALW SP2000 as I quite like it for some reason; even through I am an engineering brown thumb, the LAA were very helpful about what I would have to do to import one and get it on the register, and put me i touch with membership who are extremely supportive and willing to donate time, tools and expertise for the love of it. Sadly, we bought this house!

[facthunter]

CASA wanted to divest themselves of the AUF/RAAus all along. Their desired wt Limit was the Tomahawk and C152 AUW. At THAT time the situation Here in Aus was going along very well but I would suggest we haven't done as well any Many other countries Have since. My View is the same as Middo's is reported to be.  Nev